1 2 3 KERRVILLE-KERR COUNTY JOINT AIRPORT BOARD 4 Regular Meeting 5 Monday, September 21, 2015 6 8:30 a.m. 7 Airport Terminal Conference Room 8 1877 Airport Loop Road 9 Kerrville, Texas 10 11 MEMBERS PRESENT: MEMBERS ABSENT: 12 Stephen King, President Corey Walters, Vice-President 13 Ed Livermore Bill Wood 14 Kirk Griffin 15 AIRPORT BOARD STAFF PRESENT: 16 Bruce McKenzie, Airport Manager Carole Dungan, Executive Assistant 17 18 COUNTY STAFF PRESENT: Tom Moser, Commissioner Pct. 2 19 Jonathan Letz, Commissioner Pct.3 Brenda Doss, Auditor 20 21 CITY STAFF PRESENT: Jack Pratt, Mayor 22 Sandra Yarbrough, Finance Director 23 VISITORS: 24 Patrick O'Fiel, airport attorney Curt Hollenbeak Tom Kita, Primero Engineering Rob Dalton 25 Manuel Rizo, RizoJet Avionics Barry Hodkin, Mooney Aviation 2 1 I N D E X September 21, 2015 2 PAGE 3 CALLED TO ORDER 4 1. VISITORS FORUM 3 5 2. KERRVILLE-KERR COUNTY JOINT AIRPORT BOARD 6 MEMBER FORUM 3 7 3. CONSENT AGENDA 3A Approval of Aug. 12, 2015 Board Meeting Minutes 5 8 4. DISCUSSION AND POSSIBLE ACTION 9 4A Monthly Financials- August 5 10 4B Mooney Roof project 7 11 4C RizoJet Avionics International 29 12 4D New T-Hangars 59 13 4E Airport restaurant and turbine maintenance facility 93 14 4F Letter of interest to repave Taxiway Echo and 15 build new T-hangars 97 16 4G Cost of upgrading Paint Hangar 113 17 4H Airport interlocal agreement 121 18 5. INFORMATION AND DISCUSSION: 5A General Update 124 19 6. EXECUTIVE SESSION -- 20 7. ADJOURNMENT 128 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Monday, September 21, 2015, at 8:30 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerrville-Kerr County Joint Airport Board was 3 held in the Airport Terminal Conference Room, Louis Schreiner 4 Field, Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were 5 had in open session: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 MR. KING: All right, I'll call this meeting to 8 order of the Kerrville-Kerr County Joint Airport Board, 9 September 21st. Item Number 1, Visitors' Forum. At this 10 time, any person with business not scheduled on the agenda 11 may speak with the Airport Board. No deliberation or action 12 may be taken on these items because the Open Meetings Act 13 requires an item to be posted for 72 hours before the 14 meeting. Visitors are asked to limit their presentations to 15 three minutes. Anybody? Visitors' Forum. Do you have 16 anything, Barry? 17 MR. HODKIN: Sorry? 18 MR. KING: Do you have anything? 19 MR. HODKIN: No. 20 MR. KING: Okay. Item 2, the Kerrville-Kerr County 21 Joint Airport Board Member Forum. At this time, any member 22 of the airport -- Kerrville-Kerr County Joint Airport Board 23 may speak to the board and/or the public present on any 24 matter not scheduled on the agenda. No action can be taken 25 on these items because the Open Meetings Act requires it to 4 1 be scheduled for at least 72 hours before the meeting. If 2 formal action is required, item will be placed on the agenda 3 for a future meeting. Anybody on the board have anything 4 they'd like to say? Ed, are you talking? I'd like -- just 5 like to say one thing. Jason -- Jason Slaughter and George 6 Salinas work for us at the airport. George is going -- he's 7 our part-time help. He'll be leaving in October. 8 MR. SALINAS: How's it going? 9 MR. KING: George will be leaving October 1, and 10 then we'll get him hopefully back sometime next year, if he 11 doesn't find a better job. (Laughter.) Hopefully. And they 12 do a great job out here. Jason's just taken over here in the 13 last couple of months, and he's just done a magnificent job 14 of getting this place in shape, and doing things that we 15 never even thought about needed done. And I just want to 16 thank them, commend them for the help they're doing out here. 17 Y'all guys see them a lot of times running up and down the 18 road on the mowers and stuff like that, but they do a lot. I 19 mean, they do a lot. They do -- pretty much take care of the 20 airport outside of the office. I want to thank them both, 21 and thank you, George, very much. 22 MR. SALINAS: Yes, sir. 23 MR. KING: Appreciate it. If I had it in the 24 budget right now, you'd be on full time. 25 MR. SALINAS: That's my understanding, yes, sir. 5 1 (Applause.) 2 MR. LIVERMORE: One thing that might be mentioned, 3 when y'all walked in this morning, you might have noticed the 4 building kind of glowing. It's because they watered 5 yesterday and cleaned it, got rid of all the mess outside. 6 MR. KING: Very nice. 7 MR. SALINAS: Y'all have a good day. 8 MR. KING: Thank you, guys. Appreciate it. Anyone 9 else? No one else being heard, Consent Agenda. All items 10 listed on the consent agenda are considered routine by Board 11 and will be enacted in one motion. No separate discussion 12 unless a board member or citizen requests, in which event the 13 item will be removed from the general order of business and 14 considered in normal sequence. Item 3A, the approval of the 15 2000 -- of the August 12th, 2015 minutes by the board. 16 MR. WOOD: I make a motion we approve the minutes 17 as written. 18 MR. KING: Second? 19 MR. GRIFFIN: I'll second. 20 MR. KING: Second. Any discussion on the minutes? 21 All in favor? 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 5-0.) 23 MR. KING: 5-0. Item 4, Discussion and Possible 24 Action. Monthly Financials. Brenda? Is there any 25 significant changes we need to know about, or anything we 6 1 need to know about on the financials? 2 MS. DOSS: No significant changes, no. 3 MR. KING: Any questions by board members? 4 MR. WOOD: Are we within budget? 5 MS. DOSS: Yes. There's a few line items that are 6 over budget that need to be transferred, but otherwise, 7 everything's okay. The bottom line is good. 8 MR. WOOD: Okay. I never get a chance to read this 9 on my computer when it comes in; it's too fine a print. 10 So -- 11 MR. KING: Are we at the end? This is the last 12 month? 13 MR. McKENZIE: No, sir. 14 MAYOR PRATT: Next one. 15 MR. McKENZIE: Next one will be the last. 16 MR. KING: This is the 11th month? 17 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 18 MAYOR PRATT: I got a question. 19 MR. KING: Yes, sir? 20 MAYOR PRATT: With all the rain we've had in the 21 first part of the summer, we came out pretty good on mowing? 22 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. We just completed our 23 fifth mowing cycle; we have six budgeted. That got it. 24 MAYOR PRATT: That carried us with one month left 25 over? 7 1 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, that's correct. 2 MAYOR PRATT: One mowing left. That was a good 3 deal. 4 MR. KING: So, we have one cycle left? 5 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, one left, and our month 6 ends in two weeks, so we made it. 7 MR. KING: Oh, good. That's good. Okay. Any 8 other questions on the financials? None being heard, motion 9 to approve? 10 MR. LIVERMORE: I so move. 11 MR. WALTERS: Second. 12 MR. KING: Second by Mr. Walters. Any discussion? 13 All in favor? 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 5-0.) 15 MR. KING: 5-0. Item 4B, the Mooney roof project. 16 Tom and Barry. Wait, that's -- are we going to do that in 17 open session? 18 MR. McKENZIE: Mm-hmm. 19 MR. KING: Okay. 20 MR. GRIFFIN: You might want to move. 21 MR. McKENZIE: All right, Tom. This is Tom Kita, 22 for those of you that don't know him, from Primero 23 Engineering. There you go. 24 MR. KITA: Thank you very, very much for this 25 opportunity to address the board. Your -- your roofing 8 1 project is going quite well. Again, my name is Tom Kita, and 2 I'm the building envelope consultant that's working on this. 3 I work with Primero Engineering. This is the -- the Mooney 4 site. You can see, that's a rather complicated, complex -- 5 MR. McKENZIE: Want to sit down so they can see? 6 MR. KITA: That works fine. Complicated set of 7 structures that are at various different ages of -- of 8 construction. In terms of where -- where are we right now, 9 this gives you an overall view of -- of the status of the 10 project. I have additional slides that break out the 11 different -- different percentages of completion. This 12 particular slide shows you the -- the areas that are 13 completed 100 percent to 50 percent. As you can see, quite a 14 bit of it -- 15 MR. WOOD: Can you point with a marker? 'Cause I 16 can't read that. 17 MR. KITA: I don't know if we can make that any 18 larger. 19 MR. McKENZIE: Use your pointer. 20 MR. WOOD: Show us the 100 percent. 21 MR. KITA: There you go. If you look at this, we 22 have -- right here, this particular building's 100 percent. 23 This one's 100 percent. 24 MR. LIVERMORE: You mean completed? 25 MR. KITA: Completed, yes, sir. 9 1 MR. LIVERMORE: Okay. 2 MR. KITA: This one's 100 percent. This one is 3 100 percent. This building is 100 percent. This one is 4 100 percent. This particular building is 50 percent. This 5 one right here, the Hammer House, is 90 percent. We have -- 6 this particular manufacturing aspect, it's also 90 percent. 7 MR. LIVERMORE: What did the previous slide show? 8 I couldn't see. I couldn't really read it either. 9 MR. KITA: The -- it just told -- it shows you a 10 total of all the buildings and -- and what their percentage 11 of completion is. And I have separate slides on -- on each 12 progression of the completion. This -- this particular one 13 we just went over is 100 percent to 50 percent complete. 14 MR. KING: I see. 15 MR. KITA: This particular slide is the projects we 16 have 10 percent complete. The large building is 10 percent. 17 The Quonset hut is 10 percent. This building, Number 5, 18 Number 6, and Number 14, is 10 percent. 19 MR. LIVERMORE: I thought on the next slide, it was 20 a much greater percent. I don't understand -- 21 MR. WALTERS: Just the one part. 22 MR. KING: Just a portion of it. 23 MR. LIVERMORE: Oh, you're dividing it into -- 24 slicing it up. Okay, thanks. Okay. 25 MR. KITA: This particular slide shows you the -- 10 1 the percentage of the -- shows the buildings that have not 2 been worked on at this time. Well, we have this little 3 connection building in between the maintenance and the 4 Quonset hut which has not been worked on. We have this -- 5 this building right here, which is a storage for parts; it 6 hasn't been worked on yet. Or this small block house; that 7 has not been worked on. Now, in terms of -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Tom, let we ask you a question 9 on schedule. So, with all of that, where is this project 10 on -- relative to the schedule? 11 MR. KITA: That's a good question, and I'm going to 12 get to that right now. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 14 MR. KITA: This is an overall tabulation of the 15 progress of the -- the project, and it's a very busy -- a 16 very busy slide, and I'm going to go into it and make it a 17 little bit less busy for you. And we look -- in terms of 18 completion, we looked at the completion of it, and in two 19 different terms. It's really difficult to try and -- and 20 make a co-relationship of building size versus the 21 dollar-cost value of the buildings, so for -- for our 22 understanding, we can -- we have 30 percent of the entire 23 project complete in terms of building size, and that breaks 24 down to approximately 79,884 square feet. The total -- the 25 total footprint of the project is 279,547, which means 11 1 there's approximately 200,000 square feet to be completed. 2 In terms of the dollar assessment, 41 percent of the project 3 is complete by dollar-wise, and 30 percent basically is 4 complete in terms of building size. When we break that down 5 into the contract days, the Cram Roofing, in their notice -- 6 their bid proposal, showed they could complete this project 7 in 210 days. And -- and in terms of what is completed 8 to-date, we have 86 days complete, and we have 124 days 9 remaining. The majority of the difficult projects -- aspects 10 of the project, which has been the Hammer House and -- is 11 almost done, so once we get the -- the most difficult aspect 12 of the project completed, that -- and it's going to leave us 13 approximately 200,000 square feet of building area. If you 14 do an estimate of them completing 5,000 square feet a day, by 15 spring, they should be able to do that in 40 continuous days, 16 if they work that way. They have 124 days according to this 17 chart, so at this point, I think we're in very good shape as 18 far as the progression of this project. 19 MR. KING: Tom, how many days a week are they 20 working right now? 21 MR. KITA: They're working, I believe -- what is 22 it, Barry, five -- five days? 23 MR. HODKIN: It's been variable. They've been 24 working weekends as well, and therefore not during the week, 25 necessarily, especially on the construction stuff, so they're 12 1 not disrupting production. Some days the weather's bad, so 2 we don't see them then, but I'd say generally at least four, 3 maybe five days a week. 4 MR. KITA: Yes. 5 MR. KING: Do you anticipate that when they get 6 through with the Hammer House, that they'll be able to go 7 back on the regular schedule, Barry? Where they can go work 8 during the week instead of on the weekends? 9 MR. DALTON: We've been accommodating them where, 10 if it's safe to work underneath, we've allowed them to work 11 in the week -- recommend them to work in the week. 12 MR. HODKIN: I'm not sure of any more construction, 13 except for maybe the week between the -- 14 MR. KING: That's what I was getting at. 15 MR. HODKIN: -- maintenance building and the 16 Quonset hut. That's just a "no big deal" job. 17 MR. KING: When they're through with the 18 construction part, there shouldn't be a reason that they 19 can't go back to a normal work week? 20 MR. HODKIN: Oh, no. I would -- 21 MR. KING: Working on top of the roof and not 22 underneath the bottom. 23 MR. HODKIN: I would expect that to be the case. 24 MAYOR PRATT: How is that 12 percent spread going 25 to work out? You got the 41 percent utilization money now, 13 1 and 29 percent; that's your 12 percent spread. 2 MR. HODKIN: Well, that's -- Tom knows better than 3 I do, but a lot of that spread comes from the payments for -- 4 the advance payments for materials. 5 MAYOR PRATT: Okay, so that's -- so you got your 6 retention and all of that, okay. 7 MR. KITA: Yes. 8 MR. HODKIN: So, I'll just mention this gentleman 9 is Rob Dalton. For those of you who know Chad Nelson, Chad 10 retired about six weeks ago. Rob is Chad's replacement. 11 MR. KING: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, overall, Barry, as far as 13 the reconstruction knowledge, is it going well or is -- the 14 schedule looks pretty good? 15 MR. HODKIN: I'd say generally pretty good. 16 There's issues now and again, but I think the cooperation's 17 been working okay as well, and Tom's involvement has been 18 working okay, so I've got no major -- 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, fantastic. 20 MR. HODKIN: Well, I have one heartache, and that's 21 what the change order is going to be, but that's something 22 different. 23 MAYOR PRATT: That was my next question. 24 MR. KITA: This has been a very good project. It's 25 been moving relatively smoothly without -- without a 14 1 majority -- without that many complications. Of course, I've 2 never been on any type of construction project that didn't 3 have some snafus in it and some issues, but this one's been 4 moving quite well. We would have liked to have seen the 5 contractor be a little more aggressive in their construction 6 on the Hammer House. But when you consider the complexity of 7 that, and the fact that this is -- this is manufacturing in 8 process, and we're trying to do a major renovation of the 9 Hammer House, and -- and keeping a coordination between the 10 contractor and Mooney and Barry and the manufacturing 11 processes is a feat in itself, so that Barry's not -- and 12 Mooney's not -- not inconvenienced by the installation of the 13 construction that's taken place. 14 MR. KING: Tom, what was -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: Of the 41 percent I was talking about 16 money a while ago, what percentage of that is due to change 17 orders? 18 MR. HODKIN: As of yet, none. 19 MR. KITA: We have zero change orders. There's one 20 pending right now that we have not finished evaluating 21 everything that we -- there's some decisions that need to be 22 made on Mooney's part. 23 MAYOR PRATT: Okay. 24 MR. HODKIN: Which Mooney's -- and the board, 25 because they potentially involve a change order. So -- so, 15 1 if we get to that stage, then, obviously, I'd like Bruce to 2 fill in -- he will handle the board from there, hopefully. 3 MR. KITA: This -- 4 MR. KING: So, Tom, you have no change orders at 5 this moment right now? They haven't presented you with any 6 change orders other than the one? 7 MR. KITA: That's it. 8 MR. KING: Have you asked them if there is any they 9 just haven't presented yet? 10 MR. KITA: No, I haven't, but, you know, -- 11 MR. KING: Sometimes bad news comes at the end. 12 MR. KITA: -- we keep in contact with them. And my 13 technician is out here several times during the month. We 14 keep track of what they're doing. We've had -- and we have 15 an open line of communication with the contractor. There -- 16 there have been a few issues come up which we had our 17 engineering department take care of it relatively simple as 18 to the -- there's been some issues with some -- with 19 some purlins, and we've gone ahead and made some design 20 decisions how to handle those with -- in terms of change 21 orders. And when you compare the value of the project, it's 22 been very -- very, very minuscule. 23 MR. WOOD: Can I ask a question? Tom, you may have 24 covered this, but I just want to be clear. It's 41 percent 25 complete on -- on the financial part, the paying. It's 16 1 30 percent complete on progress. I assume the reason that 2 the 41 percent is larger is that a lot of the material has 3 already been bought and paid for. It's just the labor now 4 that needs to be completed? Is that -- 5 MAYOR PRATT: Advance payment, too. 6 MR. WOOD: Okay. So, that's not something to be 7 concerned about. It's just the -- 8 MR. KITA: No. 9 MR. WOOD: You can almost break down the percentage 10 into two different categories. 11 MR. KITA: Well, in order to make sense of it, I 12 have to do that on that one slide, because it gives you a 13 misleading perception when you start looking at square 14 footage, because the majority of -- if you look at the value 15 cost, you look at that Hammer House, it was very expensive. 16 MR. WOOD: Right. 17 MR. KING: Can you go back to that? 18 MR. KITA: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, if you look at square 20 footage, some of the -- some of it's complex; some of it's 21 less so. 22 MR. KING: Can you go back to that slide, Tom? 23 What was it, the Hammer House? 24 MR. KITA: Yes. The Hammer House is -- 25 MR. WOOD: Building Number 2 at the top. 17 1 MR. KITA: Yes, Building Number 2. 2 MR. KING: What was the budget on that? 3 MR. KITA: Let's see. Here we go. It's $395,000, 4 okay? The -- the only -- that's item -- that's Number 2; 5 Building Number 2. If you look at it, it's only 7 percent of 6 the building area, but if we come -- and that's 7 percent. 7 Here's your 395,000. We projected that there's 355,000 8 completed. Now, if we come down to the next building, which 9 is Number 14, it's $166,000. So, when you start looking at 10 this, you can see where the majority of the cost is going. 11 We have Building Number 9. Building Number 9 is the great 12 big building; it's 424,000, and represents 38 percent of the 13 square footage. So, once that building is completed, a whole 14 lot of square footage is -- is now taken out of that category 15 and put into completed category. 16 MR. WOOD: So, square foot and cost per building 17 don't necessarily relate? 18 MR. KITA: They are not exact. 19 MR. WOOD: That's why it might look a little askew? 20 MR. KITA: It does skew it some. Now, there -- 21 there are a couple of decisions to be made, and I -- we have 22 two of them. One is Building Number 15 -- or Item Number 15, 23 Building Number 28, if we're going to do that one or not. 24 It's the small block building. Then we have another decision 25 to be made on Area Number 29, and let me back up to -- 18 1 there's Building Number 29, and here's Building Number 28. 2 There's -- there's some decisions that need to be made by 3 Mooney and Barry as to how we proceed with those buildings; 4 if we're going to demo Building Number 29, B, and leave it, 5 or are we going to go ahead and rebuild it? 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: "Demo" meaning demolish? 7 MR. KITA: Demolish. 8 MR. WALTERS: Since that is airport property, what 9 is -- why is it being considered as a demo? 10 MR. KITA: Well, it's in really, really bad shape. 11 And -- 12 MR. WALTERS: Would it be replaced? 13 MR. KITA: We're -- right now, the plan is for 14 replacement of the roofing structure on it. 15 MR. WALTERS: Talking about the building itself, if 16 you demo it, would you replace the whole building? 17 MR. KITA: Well, it's just a lean-to. 18 MR. WALTERS: Okay. 19 MR. KITA: Like a shed that was an afterthought. A 20 connection in between the -- the Quonset hut, and it's this 21 maintenance building. 22 MAYOR PRATT: It's not completely closed in? 23 MR. KITA: No. No. So -- 24 MR. WALTERS: And what about Building Number 15? 25 MR. KITA: Building Number 15 right here, Building 19 1 Number 28 is this -- it's a small -- the small block house. 2 That particular building is -- again, that's another decision 3 to be made. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What's the use for it, Barry? 5 MR. HODKIN: Storage. Paper storage, documents. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. Let me remind 7 everybody, I think this is -- everything seems to be going 8 very well, but it's fairly complex management-wise. The 9 contract is with Mooney to have the work done. Tom and 10 company are advisers looking after the -- the project 11 technically, reporting to the board, okay, the owners of 12 which are the City and the County. So, I think it's -- I 13 think this whole group is to be complimented on doing 14 something that's fairly complex as far as ownership and 15 responsibility and advice, and it all seems to be going 16 extremely well. 17 MR. KITA: There have -- it is difficult to -- to 18 keep track of this stuff, since our -- my responsibility is 19 to the board. I work for the board. We -- we advise Mooney 20 and Barry, but it's -- you hired -- you hired Tom Kita and 21 Primero Engineering to look after your best interests, and so 22 we -- we kind of are the mesh to keep this project moving to 23 everybody's best interest. The most important aspect of it 24 that -- that we view was the complexity of the coordination 25 of the contractor and Mooney so that we could get these 20 1 buildings repaired without causing any hardship to Mooney. 2 And so far, I think everybody, particularly the board, can be 3 complimented on doing this. And it's been -- it's been 4 running very smoothly. There has been little snafus in it, 5 and we've been able to nip those off and -- and resolve -- 6 resolve them. It's just the aspects you find on every 7 construction project. I wish I could have a perfect one, but 8 I'd probably have a heart attack if I ever had that. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tom, how weather-dependent is 10 it going to be going into the fall and winter? I mean, these 11 large buildings that are -- two large ones that are left, 12 that are only 10 percent -- 13 MR. KITA: Well, it's really not going to be 14 that -- these -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go back to that slide. 16 MR. WOOD: You know, the reason we're doing this in 17 the beginning is so Mooney has a place to do their work in a 18 safe manner. 19 MR. KITA: Absolutely. 20 MR. WOOD: So they don't have a leaking roof. And 21 looking at the paper this morning, Dr. Doppler says that 22 we've had some real dry weather, but he expects it to change, 23 and that we should have some extra wet weather, you know, 24 maybe next month going forward. 25 MR. KITA: Yes. 21 1 MR. WOOD: So, I think a priority might be looking 2 at where this manufacturing is done. I don't want to speak 3 for you, Barry, but you don't want those roofs leaking. 4 MR. KITA: Well, that's right. I love the -- the 5 prognostication of the weather people, but they're never 6 right. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- but more generally, 8 we're going into our seasonally cool, wet period of the year, 9 if we have one. 10 MR. KITA: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, I mean, how dependent is 12 this product you're using to work on that -- is it going 13 to -- if we get, like we did last winter, a month of drizzly 14 wet weather, what's that going to do to the project? 15 MR. KITA: Well, it's going to stymie it some. I 16 mean, -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's -- 18 MR. KITA: -- we can't go out -- we can't expect 19 the roofing contractor to install the manufacturer's products 20 in conditions that are not acceptable to that manufacturer. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's my question. What are 22 the conditions? Does it have to be clear? What temperature 23 range? 24 MR. KITA: Well, it's a coating, so, obviously, you 25 don't want to have excessive dew and moisture on the surface 22 1 of the material that you're applying the coating to. So, it 2 needs to be relatively dry. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a temperature -- 4 MR. KITA: There are. As with all products, the 5 manufacturer will give you a temperature range. Normally, 6 the low temperature range is in the 40-degree term. 7 MAYOR PRATT: Daytime. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 9 MAYOR PRATT: I got a -- let me follow up with a 10 question along similar lines. How comfortable do you feel, 11 Barry, as to protecting your manufacturing process with where 12 they are right now? 13 MR. HODKIN: Well, the main area of concern was the 14 Hammer House, because of -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: And that's almost -- that's 90 16 percent. 17 MR. HODKIN: -- because of the equipment in there. 18 We have some blocking issues, so as far as I'm concerned, if 19 the construction work is all complete in the next few weeks 20 before what you're ultimately talking about, we should be in 21 good shape. Now, remember, all of the buildings leak to a 22 degree, so the big building over there, Number 9 -- 23 MAYOR PRATT: I assume the Number 9, the big 24 building, will go faster than -- 25 MR. HODKIN: Yes, it will. 23 1 MAYOR PRATT: -- than all of our square foot -- on 2 a per-square-footage basis. 3 MR. KITA: Oh, yes. 4 MAYOR PRATT: You know, you're looking at a vast 5 building, but time-wise, it's not taking a lot of time. 6 MR. HODKIN: What we have done from the start of 7 the project is Mooney has been -- has the responsibility for 8 prioritizing the buildings. 9 MAYOR PRATT: Yeah. 10 MR. HODKIN: And that's what we sought to do. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's the beauty of 12 contracting arrangements. 13 MR. HODKIN: Well, it is, but it's also the beauty 14 of the -- of the relationship that we've all been working 15 together on, so we've never really -- I'm sure Tom has, but 16 I've never looked at the contract. 17 MAYOR PRATT: So, if you're satisfied, we should be 18 satisfied. 19 MR. HODKIN: Yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What is the scheduled 21 completion date, just per the contract? Per the contract. 22 MR. KITA: The contract was for 210 days. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, what's that date? 24 MR. KITA: I -- offhand -- 25 MR. HODKIN: I want to say it was sometime -- 24 1 sometime in the spring. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 3 MR. HODKIN: I think the contractual dates where 4 damages start to accrue, I think, is in March. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 6 MR. HODKIN: So we're still within that. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, great. All right. 8 MR. HODKIN: I may be wrong on that, but that's my 9 memory. 10 MAYOR PRATT: Yeah, it's February sometime, I 11 think. 12 MR. KITA: And, you know, you've been in this -- 13 this type of business before, and there's -- there's all 14 kinds of -- 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sure. 16 MR. KITA: -- deducts that occur, and adds to the 17 contract time for allotment of weather and conditions, and 18 coordination issues with -- with both parties. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Very good. 20 MR. KITA: And when we get to that point, that will 21 be the time that -- that the board and Barry and Mooney need 22 to sit down as to, do you implement the $500 a day of 23 liquidated damages? 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We won't get to that, 25 hopefully. 25 1 MR. KITA: I look at this in a more realistic 2 manner of -- of where we are, where we're going, how we're 3 going to get there, and what do we have left? And, you know, 4 we -- they put on their contract and their bid form 210 days, 5 and they've -- when we start looking at the -- what they have 6 accomplished, it's 86 days worth of work. And, really, I 7 think it's very -- very realistic of where we -- where we are 8 right now, and where we're going and what we have. The 124 9 days remaining, you take -- you take this building right 10 here, which is Number 9; it's 105,000 square feet, a huge -- 11 huge building, okay? They've already -- they've already 12 worked on this building, and I believe they closed in all 13 these skylights already. 14 MR. KING: Yeah. 15 MR. DALTON: They're not all completed. 16 MR. KITA: They're not all completed. They've 17 done -- 10 percent of the building is complete, so 90 percent 18 is left. There are some modifications that are going to be 19 required to the surface of the -- the metal R-panels. Once 20 those are completed, it's just a matter of coming back with 21 your spray crew and spraying a coating -- a primer and a 22 coating to the surface of it, and it's going to move 23 relatively fast. I -- I estimated, you know, that you should 24 be able to do 35,000 square feet a day, which I don't believe 25 is unreasonable. But there's no doubt in my mind that they 26 1 may be able to get 10,000 square feet per day completed. So, 2 it's -- 3 MR. KING: They've already -- have they power -- 4 they've already power-washed that building, haven't they? 5 MR. HODKIN: Yeah, they power-washed it and they 6 tightened all the screws up. 7 MR. KING: Tightened -- they did all the screws, 8 quite a bit of work. 9 MR. KITA: They have -- 10 MR. KING: Labor and all. 11 MR. KITA: They will be doing some additional 12 power-washing in order to get the residual stuff just from 13 the atmosphere and from the operation of the airport. So, 14 really, we're in good shape. We're in good shape. And -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: Just a quick calculation; the 124 16 days, what you -- you put it up there. As of what date? In 17 other words, is this -- is this update as of September 15th, 18 or -- 19 MR. KITA: Approximately. 20 MAYOR PRATT: So, it will us take 124 out from 21 September 15th. 22 MR. KITA: Like we had talked, Corey -- what was 23 it? It was like the 9th or -- or 10th. We had our 24 technician out here with Cram Roofing, and they walked every 25 building, and we did another assessment of the condition of 27 1 the -- the R-panels, and that's where we came up with those 2 numbers. 3 MAYOR PRATT: So, if you take the -- just take the 4 September 15th, like, October, November, December, and 5 January, plus four days; there's your 124 days. You were 6 trying to find a -- 7 MR. HODKIN: From my point of view, that needs to 8 be complete as soon as possible, 'cause we're not paying for 9 excess days, so the onus is on them. The pressure's on them 10 to beat that. 11 MAYOR PRATT: Sure. 12 MR. GRIFFIN: You got to remember, you're counting 13 the days. 14 MAYOR PRATT: I'm counting days rather than work 15 days, and I understand that. 16 MR. GRIFFIN: Yeah, so you're more like the 17 February date that Barry's tracking, too. So -- 18 MAYOR PRATT: I understand, but it was just 19 ballparking. 20 MR. KITA: We can look at it in terms of maybe 20 21 days a week (sic), if possible, and without some anomaly 22 coming in and making changes. Of course, we do have -- we 23 have holidays coming up; that's going to slow things down. 24 And, again, as you pointed out, weather. Weather issues, 25 those are items that are beyond our control. 28 1 MR. KING: Anybody have anything else for Tom? 2 MR. WOOD: Thanks, Tom. Keep it up. 3 MR. KING: Tom, I want to -- from the board, I want 4 to thank you very much. I don't think the public realizes 5 how much we've really relied on Tom to do this project. I 6 don't think, without Tom and his firm, we could have -- we 7 could have come anywhere close to getting that done, what's 8 done already, and he's helped us out a bunch on this thing. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, he has. 10 MR. KING: Thank you, Tom. 11 MR. LIVERMORE: Thank you, Tom. 12 MR. KITA: If you have any questions -- you leave 13 and you have some questions, -- 14 MR. LIVERMORE: Call? 15 MR. KITA: -- call, send me an e-mail, whatever. 16 We'll take care of whatever it is you have. 17 MR. KING: Thank you, Tom. 18 MR. WALTERS: Thank you, Tom. 19 MR. KITA: Yes, sir. 20 MR. HODKIN: Thanks, guys. 21 MR. KING: Thanks, Barry. Thank you. Nice to meet 22 you. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: See you, Tom. Good job, 24 buddy. 25 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 29 1 MR. KING: When y'all are mumbling like that to 2 each other, it's very difficult for our stenographer over 3 here. She's taking down mumbles; she ends up putting, 4 "mumble, mumble, mumble," and Kirk. Okay. 5 MR. WOOD: Just write down, "mumble, mumble" if you 6 can't make it out. 7 MR. KING: Item 4C, RizoJet Avionics International 8 proposal. Do you have a proposal for us, or a -- where are 9 we going with this? 10 MR. McKENZIE: He wants to just visit with the 11 board. 12 MR. KING: Address the board, yes, sir. 13 MR. WOOD: Did everybody get the letter? 14 MR. GRIFFIN: Last week. 15 MR. LIVERMORE: Yeah, we got it. 16 MR. KING: Okay. I'll start by saying I know 17 Manuel from Hondo. 18 MR. LIVERMORE: Here it is. 19 MR. KING: Manuel's been in Hondo for how many 20 years, Manuel? 21 MR. RIZO: Been in Hondo for 11 years. 22 MR. KING: Eleven years. He has an avionics shop 23 down there. I've known him personally and seen his work, and 24 -- and he's a good guy. He does a good job. He's very 25 accredited -- accredited in the field, and having an interest 30 1 in possibly moving to Kerrville. So, go ahead. 2 MR. RIZO: Thank you, Steve, for the kind words. 3 The board and Bruce, thank you for the opportunity to allow 4 me to speak to you here today. As Steve indicated, I have an 5 avionics shop and maintenance shop in Hondo. I've been there 6 11 years. We're an F.A.A. certified repair station. We 7 specialize in King Air, Citations, Falcons, Hawkers, and some 8 other aircraft that are out there. But we have a need to 9 relocate to a different airport, and we chose Kerrville 10 because of the quality of life and what -- some good things 11 that we've heard about Kerrville; easy access to San Antonio, 12 to the airport, and we've talked to some of our customers, 13 and they've indicated the same. It's a good choice to do 14 that. And Hondo's been good for us. We've been successful 15 in Hondo. We've worked -- just to give you an idea, we've 16 worked over 500 aircraft in the last 11 years, and we've had 17 -- not had any incidents, accidents, any lawsuits whatsoever. 18 We have a really good relationship with the F.A.A. in San 19 Antonio at our FSDO. 20 I -- I personally have my M.P. and inspector 21 authorization, as well as my commercial instrument pilot's 22 license. Originally from Uvalde, so when you get the letter, 23 you'll be able to see that our -- our focus is really to try 24 to grow our company. In the 11 years that we've been in 25 Hondo, we've had a lot of, I should say, turnover in the 31 1 airport board, airport management, city management, and it's 2 been very difficult for us to make a commitment for long-term 3 growth. And, you know, this morning when I walked in, I had 4 a question, you know, that was asked to me whether, you know, 5 I'm wasting somebody's time -- anybody's time here. I'm 6 not -- and I'm not. You know, when I came to speak to Bruce 7 here about three weeks ago, I told him what our plans were, 8 what we want to do and how we want to grow, and we want to 9 grow in Kerrville that way, and very sincere about that. And 10 that's one of the things that has allowed us to grow, is, you 11 know, hey, it's the way that I do business and the way that 12 our customers keep coming back to us. And I think that 13 Kerr -- I think that we -- having our business here and 14 coming to Kerrville will help the businesses here in 15 Kerrville at the airport, and I hope help me to grow. So, 16 with that, if you have any questions, I'd like to -- 17 MR. LIVERMORE: Manuel, you're looking for 10,000 18 to 12,000 feet. Is there such -- are you -- where on this 19 airport right now, at least as -- I know you would ultimately 20 like to see us build a hangar that would work for your 21 business, but where would you be in the meantime? 22 MR. RIZO: Well, in the meantime -- I understand 23 that there is no available hangar space in the meantime, and 24 what I'm looking for is the possibility of getting a hangar 25 built. And I understand -- and the research that I've done, 32 1 it could take from a year to two years, and Bruce and I 2 looked at a couple of spaces here on the field that would 3 work for us. I'm sure that there's more towards the north 4 side of the airport, but, you know, in the immediate area, 5 none in that location. But my understanding, and I think 6 Bruce can better answer that, there is no available hangar 7 space that the City/County owns. 8 MR. McKENZIE: That's correct. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, let me put it in 10 perspective. So, sort of the status now is you've got an 11 established business. You have an interest in moving to 12 Kerrville, okay, and that -- that's characterized by your 13 letter. But there hasn't been anything put together as far 14 as the business feasibility of it, what it would cost to 15 do -- in other words, a business plan, and why -- why the 16 City and County would invest in something like this, or -- or 17 the option of leasing you the land and let you build the 18 building. Where does all that stand? 19 MR. RIZO: Well, I'll answer that, is that I -- 20 I've come here to -- first of all, to speak to you and to 21 introduce myself, and if you have any questions, you can ask 22 those. And that's a really good question, is that in any 23 kind of business plan -- and in any relocation, there is a 24 business plan. There's introduction of financials and 25 everything else that goes along with that. And the way that 33 1 I discussed to Bruce is that because you meet on a monthly 2 basis, I wanted to start the process. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So -- so that's what it is 4 here, an "I'm interested in doing it"? 5 MR. RIZO: That's correct. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Super. Okay. 7 MAYOR PRATT: You state that -- 8 MR. KING: Okay, go ahead. 9 MAYOR PRATT: You state that you're paying 10 somewhere between $17 and $33 an hour. How many employees do 11 you currently have? 12 MR. RIZO: I currently have three employees. 13 MAYOR PRATT: Three? 14 MR. RIZO: Yes. And -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: You say you want to grow, so if you 16 moved here, what do you think that would go to? What's your 17 vision there? 18 MR. RIZO: I'm looking at 15 to 20 employees, is 19 what I'm looking at. You know, depending on our growth and 20 the economy and everything else that goes along with -- with 21 what affects aviation. It could be more. I want to offer -- 22 MAYOR PRATT: What's the time frame for the big 23 jump from 3 to 20? 24 MR. RIZO: From 3 to 20? 25 MAYOR PRATT: Yeah. 34 1 MR. RIZO: Well, that's within about a year and a 2 half of starting our business, -- 3 MR. WOOD: I have a question for you, -- 4 MR. RIZO: -- relocating. 5 MR. WOOD: -- Mr. Rizo. What percent of your 6 business right now is avionics, and what percent would be 7 working on the jets with -- you know, servicing jet engines 8 and things like that? 9 MR. RIZO: Right now, it's about 50/50 percent of 10 that. We -- we started out in avionics, and it was about 11 three years ago that we really started focusing on the 12 maintenance side of it, because the avionics side of it kind 13 of went down; people didn't invest very much in that side of 14 it. We knew they had to maintain their airplanes, and I 15 looked at that model, and I said, well, our customers are 16 asking for that, so we started doing the maintenance on the 17 King Airs and Citations. And we currently maintain several 18 aircraft as well, both based in the United States and in 19 Mexico. 20 MR. WOOD: Right now we don't have an avionics shop 21 here at the airport. We used to; now we don't, and anybody 22 that needs to get their yearly or biannual static checks 23 either has somebody come out here and do the work, or flies 24 somewhere else to get it done, so I think having an avionics 25 shop would be great. There would be some built-in business. 35 1 Plus we also -- am I correct, we don't have anybody here on 2 the field that does the jet maintenance? 3 MR. WALTERS: Nobody. 4 MAYOR PRATT: How many planes do you service in 5 Hondo right now? 6 MR. RIZO: We service about 50 airplanes a year. 7 MAYOR PRATT: About 50? 8 MR. RIZO: Mm-hmm. 9 MAYOR PRATT: And so if you moved to Kerrville, how 10 many of those 50 will follow you? 11 MR. RIZO: The people that I've talked to 12 indicated -- I would say about 50 percent of those would 13 follow us. And I think that, you know, it's not just looking 14 at the retention of those customers. It's the addition of 15 the customers that we would add here in Kerrville because of 16 the convenience factor. 17 MAYOR PRATT: I understand that. I'm just looking 18 at the transition part of it. 19 MR. RIZO: Right. 20 MR. WOOD: Of those customers, how many are based 21 in Hondo? None of them? 22 MR. KING: None of them, hardly. 23 MR. RIZO: It's interesting. It's -- Hondo is, 24 acreage-wise, as big or bigger than San Antonio International 25 Airport, but they only have one jet aircraft in place, and we 36 1 do work on that aircraft; it's a Phenom 100. But all of our 2 customers come from the surrounding areas, and including 3 Mexico, and they fly in. There is a paint and interior shop 4 that we work with that's located there on the field, so we 5 all -- I want to say we've tried to work together to bring 6 the airplanes in and work on them at the same time. But it's 7 -- it's always best, and I've learned this in the different 8 places that I've been and different companies that I've done 9 work for, is that if one -- one company owns a one-stop shop 10 for scheduling purposes and all those, and that's the 11 direction that I want to take. 12 MAYOR PRATT: And how do you plan to capitalize 13 that transition? Is that through state assistance or grants, 14 or -- 15 MR. RIZO: Well, in -- 16 MAYOR PRATT: -- personal money? A combination? 17 MR. RIZO: Let's break that down as far as -- you 18 know, where we're at now is that I'm not asking the City or 19 County for any money in relocating here from Hondo. As a 20 matter of fact, in the -- in the 11 years that I've been in 21 business, I've never had to borrow any money. It's just 22 everything that I've invested, I've invested right -- or 23 made, I've invested right back into the business, and 24 including a substantial amount of test equipment that we 25 utilize for the avionics and the maintenance side of it. 37 1 Now, what I am asking is that in order to facilitate our 2 move, is to have a facility that would be available -- made 3 available to us, and that could be acquired through 4 City/County contributions as -- you know, as N.P.E. funds or 5 C.I.P. funds, 'cause that's what I'm asking for. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, just ballpark, 10,000 7 square foot is probably like about a three million dollar 8 building? 9 MR. KING: No. It might be -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How much? I just ratio what 11 Avery did for 50,000 square feet for 15. 12 MR. LIVERMORE: That's a different deal. 13 MAYOR PRATT: This is a shell. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 15 MR. KING: A half a million? I mean, they're 16 building -- how big is the one -- Mike and Patrick's building 17 right now? 18 MR. RIZO: That one is about 7,000 square feet. 19 MR. KING: They're building a 7,000 square foot 20 building in Hondo right now; it's under construction. 21 MR. GRIFFIN: Steel's up. 22 MR. KING: Steel's up, $160,000 project. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, 160,000? 24 MR. KING: For 7,000. It might cost 250,000 to 25 build here in Kerrville, but for some reason -- 38 1 MR. WOOD: Sounds like you're describing -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Somewhere -- $300,000, then. 3 MR. KING: I mean, it's quite -- I mean, I know 4 that building's being built right now, and it's being built 5 by a reputable contractor out of San Antonio. That's -- 6 that's slab, everything, electrical, the whole thing. They 7 did a turnkey build, and it's an engineered building. It's 8 in the city; it has -- it's under all codes of the city. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 10 MR. KING: So -- 11 MR. RIZO: And national codes. 12 MR. WOOD: Sounds to me like you're describing 13 another Brinkman hangar with an office space and -- 14 MR. KING: About half that size. 15 MR. WOOD: Not quite as big, okay. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Is the Brinkman -- what's the 17 status of the Brinkman hangar? Is it leased for "X" number 18 of years? 19 MR. McKENZIE: Five years, yes, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Five years, okay. 21 MR. GRIFFIN: And it's fully leased. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, okay. All right. 23 MR. KING: As an example, Tom, the building being 24 built down in Hondo is being built for less than $25 a square 25 foot. 39 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. All right. 2 MR. KING: If it comes in, I mean, without any 3 change orders or anything. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 5 MR. KING: So -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So if it were $30 a square 7 foot, it would be $300,000. 8 MR. KING: Okay. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Without any offices. 10 MR. KING: Without any offices. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Just the building. 12 MR. LIVERMORE: Manuel, is 10,000 feet, for the 13 size of operation, is that enough? 14 MR. RIZO: Well, that's a start. And, I mean, I -- 15 I don't want to -- I've got a goal in mind, and what I want 16 to do is to be able to work with that and grow and invest and 17 add additional buildings as we go. You know, I've been to 18 city council meetings and meetings elsewhere in the last few 19 years, and I've seen where people go in and they just -- I've 20 seen in Hondo where they come in and B.S. I'm not going to 21 do that. I'm going to tell you exactly what I look at in the 22 short term, and then in the long term, is what I'm looking 23 at. And so I think that, you know, if we stay under the 24 12,000 square foot, then there's items in the national code 25 that we may not have to do, and that are very costly, and 40 1 that's one of the things that I -- why I mentioned that. 2 Now, could you have multiple 12,000 square foot buildings? 3 Yes. And, you know, keep in mind that I come from Uvalde, 4 and I've seen companies in Uvalde grow. I graduated in 1990 5 in Uvalde, and was there when Southstar came in; worked for 6 Southstar a couple-two years, worked for the Columbia 7 Avionics in the Sierra hangars, and I was able to see how the 8 business works, the business models and how it -- in Uvalde, 9 you know, one of the biggest employers there is the airport. 10 So, I had that experience, and I'm -- I want to do something 11 like that here. 12 MR. LIVERMORE: Do you have a location, Bruce, for 13 such a facility? 14 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 15 MR. LIVERMORE: Where would that be? 16 MR. McKENZIE: At the east end of the apron on the 17 ramp. 18 MR. LIVERMORE: Okay. 19 MR. McKENZIE: There's other areas. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And that's consistent with the 21 master plan? 22 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that -- 25 MR. McKENZIE: There's also areas on the north side 41 1 up here where we can do it as well. I'm trying to keep him 2 as close to the infrastructure as -- 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. It was consistent with 4 the master plan, got you. 5 MR. WOOD: I would assume that his business would 6 need access to the ramp and to airplanes; also -- 7 MR. McKENZIE: Certainly. 8 MR. WOOD: -- access for the public. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Certainly. Absolutely. 10 MR. GRIFFIN: It's got gates, and fully installed 11 down here, so -- 12 MR. WOOD: Yeah. 13 MR. KING: I guess on the financial side of it, we 14 don't have any funds available currently, right? N.P.E. or 15 whatever you call that? 16 MR. McKENZIE: We have -- as of now, we have 17 $150,000 banked in N.P.E. funds. 18 MR. KING: Okay. And then we have -- as far as 19 grants, as far as 90/10 money or 50/50 money, have you 20 checked with those guys? 21 MR. McKENZIE: It's whatever we -- right now 22 there's no letter of interest on file with those folks -- 23 MR. KING: Right. 24 MR. McKENZIE: -- for us to build anything. We're 25 going to talk about that today as well. But that can -- that 42 1 is one way to do that, is through that funding mechanism 2 through TexDOT. 3 MR. KING: Right. 4 MR. McKENZIE: If we do that, then we will have to 5 set aside our plans to build new T-hangars. 6 MR. WOOD: I would like to see us go to the E.I.C. 7 and talk to them. 8 MR. McKENZIE: That would be an avenue. 9 MR. KING: I think this is a situation you run into 10 in an airport, is that you can't -- you know, it's hard to 11 attract these types of businesses. I mean, these businesses 12 are -- are on other airports. Uvalde, for example, has a 13 paint shop, an interior shop. They're building a new 14 maintenance facility. I guess that's X? 15 MR. RIZO: X. 16 MR. KING: There's a maintenance shop going in 17 there, a gentleman who -- a good friend of his, and who has 18 the same basic certificates as Manuel does. He's an I.A.P., 19 and they're building -- he's building how many hangars? 20 MR. RIZO: I believe it's 12,000 square feet. 21 MR. KING: 12,000 square foot hangar being built 22 there. That's being paid for with -- is that individual 23 funds or -- 24 MR. RIZO: I believe it's from the owner of the 25 paint shop. 43 1 MR. KING: The paint shop is building it. He's 2 going to be sub-leasing it to -- to that individual. But, 3 you know, you have probably 250 people working on that 4 airport right now. It's roughly twice as many as Mooney 5 working on that small airport. So, you run into these 6 issues, is that we don't have a facility, and in most cases, 7 these types of businesses move on to the next place that does 8 have a facility, because there are places all over the 9 United -- all over Texas that have these facilities available 10 that can be modified or something like that. So, you know, 11 the decision the airport has to make with the city and with 12 the owners is, you know, do you move to that next level, that 13 next step of actually building a facility of this type? You 14 know, we've always built T-hangars because of the ability to 15 rent them, but eventually that will probably fill up at some 16 point; I mean, be not as good of a revenue source. 17 And, you know, do you build a maintenance facility 18 or some sort of facility that is rentable by a maintenance -- 19 maintenance operator, and -- and try to attract one? I mean, 20 that's just something that we've got to address as a group, I 21 believe, in the future. Because, I mean, it's not -- it's 22 not feasible. It's very difficult to have someone come here 23 and say, "Hey, would you build us a hangar?" and then we 24 don't have the funding access. There's no -- I don't think 25 there's a money fairy that shows up every Sunday and drops 44 1 money here, so, you know, the airport doesn't have it. We 2 don't have the funds available through the state right now. 3 So, you know, that's something -- I think the owners have to 4 make a decision if you want to invite development at the 5 airport for employment and for bringing jobs. 6 And, you know, I will say that most of the 7 aircraft -- a lot of the aircraft Manuel brings in, most of 8 these facilities as a whole, they operate -- they don't -- 9 most of the airplanes they do work on are not based at their 10 facility. They're aircraft that are flown in. And he brings 11 in a ton of airplanes from Mexico. He has a very good 12 relationship with Mexico operators. There's a lot of Mexican 13 operators that bring their aircraft and have them worked on 14 and stuff, do maintenance or avionics, and then they shoot 15 back to Mexico. They come back and forth, back and forth, so 16 that's just -- that's part of the way it works. You know, it 17 would be an advantage; he could work aircraft on the field. 18 But, you know, that paint shop doesn't -- doesn't paint 19 airplanes -- in Hondo, they don't paint airplanes that are 20 based in Hondo. Those airplanes, a lot come from California. 21 They have all TBM's; they have a huge number of turboprop 22 aircraft coming out of California to be painted in Hondo, 23 Texas. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think it's -- from my 25 perspective, the direction of the county, -- and Jonathan can 45 1 weigh in -- it sounds extremely interesting qualitatively. 2 You know, from what you've done, it sounds to me to be 3 admired for that. Quantitatively would be the next step, is 4 what's the business plan? And, you know, when you come to 5 somebody for an investment, is -- you know better than 6 anybody, you got to have all the facts and what the risks 7 associated with that and what potential return is. I think 8 that Steve brings up a very good point, too, as you did. The 9 synergism with it, you know, if you get here, then what other 10 potential businesses can come with that? I think that's very 11 attractive. But -- 12 MR. KING: I think you have to understand, the 13 facility is not -- it's not based strictly upon Rizo 14 Aviation. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 16 MR. KING: That facility handles A-B-C Aviation 17 also. If Rizo Aviation decides they don't want to be here 18 any more, it's not like the facility -- we'll just lock it up 19 and it's gone. It's -- it's a multi -- 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Marketable facility. 21 MR. KING: -- purpose facility, build something 22 like that. What is the rent on a facility that's owned by 23 the airport? 24 MR. McKENZIE: $3.18 a square foot. 25 MR. KING: Okay, thank you. 46 1 MR. WALTERS: I think, to me, just a follow-up to 2 Tom. Long-term, it's the direction the airport needs to go. 3 Now, the timing of it and how you get there, I'll turn that 4 over to y'all. But, I mean, I think that, you know, at some 5 point, this -- you know, building T-hangars and renting them 6 isn't going to cut it. You got to have something else to 7 bring in, you know, businesses, or -- 8 MR. KING: Sure. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- aircraft, have jobs. 10 MAYOR PRATT: Bring in businesses like this, and 11 then your demand for T-hangars goes up. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But it's not -- right 13 now, I mean, all our eggs are in Mooney and T-hangars. 14 Diversification helps. 15 MR. RIZO: I do want to mention one more thing, is 16 -- and I tried not to, because of the fact that the F.A.A. 17 can change their rules and regs and mandates and so on that 18 they've got. But one of the things that I'm looking at is 19 the ADS-B requirements in 2020, where pretty much every 20 aircraft is going to have to have that equipment installed, 21 including Canadians flying into the U.S., or -- or Mexico 22 flying into the U.S. Any aircraft that flies above 23 18,000 feet has to have that, and down below that, it depends 24 on where you fly. So, when you look at the number of 25 aircraft that are out there, you know, I'm going to put that 47 1 into my business model in there, because there's -- if you -- 2 the studies that are there from A.E.A., Aircraft Electronics 3 Association, that there isn't enough shops out there to do 4 the work on all those aircraft out there. So, my focus is 5 going to be to work with those, and if we have to train 6 people, we will. I'm very selective in the people that -- 7 that work on airplanes that I work on. You know, Mike here, 8 my employee, he -- he'll tell you that I micromanage. And, 9 you know, I do that because I want to make sure that I can 10 sleep at night; everybody's flying out there happy, you know. 11 And so that's something, you know, that I look at, that the 12 F.A.A. does not -- with the pressure of N.B.A.A. and others 13 to push it back, 2020 is right around the corner. 14 MR. WOOD: For those of you that are not in 15 aviation, the ADS-B is going to make sure that every airplane 16 both receives and transmits something that tells everybody 17 where everybody is; you don't just have to rely on A.T.C. 18 to -- 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What does "ADS-B" stand for? 20 MR. RIZO: It's Automated Dependent 21 Surveillance-Broadcast. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 23 MR. WOOD: But, anyway, it's a requirement that 24 F.A.A.'s making that all airplanes are basically going to 25 have to have some element that tells other people that 48 1 they're there. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Y'all say one more time -- you 3 said you've worked on how many aircraft and never had an 4 issue? And your relationship with F.A.A., that's huge. 5 MR. RIZO: About 500 aircraft in 11 years. And 6 keep in mind that that's between -- having between 3 to 10 7 employees, you know. And one of the other things that I'll 8 point out is that we've weathered this, you know, recession, 9 and that aviation is one of the hardest -- you know, I see 10 Mr. Kennedy back there, and, you know, he can probably tell 11 you what it does to aviation, immediately -- immediately does 12 to aviation. But that's why, you know, I changed direction 13 and added maintenance to our repair station. We knew that if 14 we just stayed in the aircraft avionics side of it, it would 15 be difficult. Some of the other things that I've done -- and 16 I didn't put that on there. I do broker aircraft as well. 17 I've sold and bought about 10 aircraft, and core customers 18 there, from King Airs to Citations. And, you know, they go 19 into Mexico and they come back into the U.S. and so on, and 20 so that's another thing that brings in revenue. 21 MR. WALTERS: I think where we are at the airport, 22 I mean, outside of somebody building -- investing their own 23 money and building a hangar, such as Joey did for the big 24 hangar here for the storage of aircraft, for individuals who 25 put their own money into the construction of a facility and 49 1 we just lease the land, we have to ask ourselves how many 2 other people have we had in the past 10 years at this airport 3 who have come and said, "I'm going to bring a business, and 4 I'm going to build a hangar, and you just lease me the land," 5 because I think the answer is really zero. So, I think where 6 we are is, to get this airport to grow in a manner where we'd 7 like to see employees and services, and bring other aircraft 8 to our facility, it's going to be incumbent upon the owners 9 to invest in the airport. We don't have the funds through 10 the state, probably, and I think that's where we are. The 11 airport owners are going to have to decide if they're willing 12 to invest in the airport to get these facilities here and to 13 grow the airport. 14 MR. KING: And along that line, Corey, it's not 15 that there's not a revenue source once someone like him 16 arrives. We have a set -- I figured it up a while ago. A 17 10,000 square foot hangar leases for $2,650 a month. I mean, 18 so there's a revenue source. I mean, that's -- we have the 19 ability to even pay back funds, you know, to pay back 20 portions of -- of money that's given to us. So, I think it's 21 a matter of, like Corey said, the City and the County, the 22 owners have got to decide, you know, do you want to invest in 23 the airport? I mean, do you want to invest in -- you know, I 24 read in the paper where we're investing in all these 25 businesses, and, you know, there's been just unbelievable 50 1 growth in Kerrville over the last five or six years, and 2 business is coming here and everything. Well, this is 3 another opportunity to -- I mean, I hate to build it -- say, 4 "Build it and they'll come," but if you don't build it, they 5 won't come. I think that's pretty much how it works in the 6 airport business. 7 MR. HOLLENBEAK: Well, there's a definite need to. 8 I mean, you're going to bring in the jet clients with this 9 kind of stuff. Right now we don't really have that. We 10 don't have the hangars for them. We don't have maintenance 11 for them. It all has to be -- to go outside, but they're the 12 ones that are going to buy the fuel, bring in the big-dollar 13 paying clients and the businesses and all that, and fund the 14 growth. So, it fits a real good need there that -- of things 15 that we don't have that we need to go that direction for the 16 long term. 17 MR. WALTERS: I personally am very excited that -- 18 that this gentleman here has come forward, and to say that he 19 has an interest in locating an established business in 20 Kerrville, Texas. 21 MR. LIVERMORE: So am I. 22 MR. KING: And not a start-up. Not something -- 23 it's not a start-up. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Established business. 25 MR. KING: Established business. 51 1 MR. WOOD: Tell us again -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Relative to E.I.C., is this 3 something that's feasible from E.I.C.? Just feasibility. 4 MAYOR PRATT: I can't speak for E.I.C. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 6 MAYOR PRATT: I can tell you that E.I.C. money's 7 there for the city. You take that for whatever it's -- 8 however you want to handle it. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. And this is the city. 10 MAYOR PRATT: This is part city. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 12 MAYOR PRATT: Okay. All right. 13 MR. WOOD: Can you tell us -- tell us again why you 14 felt like Kerrville airport was advantageous for a new 15 business? 16 MR. RIZO: Well, I did a study and looked at the 17 surrounding airports, and looked at what -- looked at what 18 they had to offer. Looked at the facilities, and looked even 19 into the detail that some of -- the tenure of some of the 20 airport management. And Kerrville's location, close to San 21 Antonio, even though it's 60 miles from San Antonio, it's 22 close to the airport. It's on I-10. Our customers that come 23 from Mexico clear customs in San Antonio; then they would fly 24 directly to Kerrville. They would stay in Kerrville, whereas 25 now they have to travel to San Antonio from Hondo. There is 52 1 no rental cars in Hondo. The logistics of being in Hondo are 2 difficult for us. But going back to Kerrville, you know, we 3 looked at the schools, we looked at employment. Most of the 4 people that work up in the San Antonio airport are people 5 that we'd be employing, so they generally live in the 6 northern part of San Antonio already. So, that's -- that's 7 the reason for looking at Kerrville, is some of those 8 reasons. 9 MR. WALTERS: I think we'd be making a huge 10 mistake -- I mean, this is the type of business that we want 11 for this airport, and we'd be making a huge mistake if we 12 don't do whatever we can to see if we can't accommodate and 13 build a facility for this type of use. 14 MAYOR PRATT: It definitely provides growth. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sounds good. 16 MAYOR PRATT: Because, you know, you -- I'm just 17 speaking as a mayor for the city. If you bring in business 18 like this and you get -- and you service jets mostly, -- 19 MR. RIZO: Yes, sir. 20 MAYOR PRATT: -- then you get those corporate -- 21 looking at ad valorem tax, and so that's revenue. 22 MR. WOOD: How many jets do we have based here, 23 roughly? 24 MR. McKENZIE: About seven right now. 25 MR. WALTERS: Six, seven. 53 1 MR. WOOD: And they probably fly to San Antonio or 2 somewhere else to get their work done, as far as -- 3 MR. WALTERS: Somewhere. 4 MR. McKENZIE: All of them. 5 MAYOR PRATT: I think a big question -- 6 MR. WALTERS: Somewhere else is the key. 7 MR. McKENZIE: That's the key. 8 MAYOR PRATT: I think another big question is -- 9 and one of you hit it a while ago, talking about you coming 10 here bringing revenue instead of people flying to Hondo. But 11 people out of here fly to Hondo to get their gas 'cause it's 12 cheaper. We need to get our gas more competitive here. 13 MR. RIZO: The way that that works is with volume, 14 so if you have more aircraft that come here, then -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: I understand. 16 MR. HOLLENBEAK: You bring in jets, you run the 17 volume way up. 18 MR. KING: Okay. How about we just -- why don't we 19 do just sort of a pro forma on what it would cost to build a 20 -- build a 10,000 square foot hangar on the airport. Let's 21 get some numbers together. I'll talk to Corrigan out of 22 Hondo, find out who that contractor is out there. Charlie 23 somebody. 24 MAYOR PRATT: I think -- I think he needs -- while 25 you're doing that, he needs to do the same thing that Tom is 54 1 suggesting; he needs to start getting the business plan 2 together. 3 MR. WALTERS: Yeah. It seems like if we can get a 4 business -- Manuel can get a business plan started, and then 5 at the same time, that we can get the gentleman from Hondo to 6 come up here, and maybe some others to give us an estimate 7 for a -- a building, so we can then go to the City and the 8 County, our owners, and tell them, "We believe this is what 9 it's going to cost." 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And to show -- Manuel, show 11 the requirements that have to be implemented by 2020. Is 12 that what it is? 13 MR. KING: ADS-B. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think, you know, that's all 15 part of it. 16 MR. KING: I mean, that mandate is -- I think I've 17 seen some figures. There's still a huge percentage; I can't 18 remember what it is, 30 percent -- 70 percent that are still 19 not compliant, because everyone's waiting for a cheaper fix. 20 Everybody's looking for -- 21 MR. RIZO: Or hoping that the F.A.A. -- 22 MR. KING: Hoping it goes away. 23 MAYOR PRATT: Or they're waiting for the -- 24 MR. KING: But somebody is waiting for, you know, 25 Walmart to come out with a fix for ADS-B, and it only costs 55 1 $500 instead of a lot. 2 MAYOR PRATT: Well, they're waiting -- like the 3 calculator, you know, when it first came out, waiting for the 4 price to come down because of volume. 5 MR. KING: But I've seen studies already done that 6 there's not enough shops right now -- if everyone started 7 doing it tomorrow, there's not enough shops to -- to get 8 everyone ADS-B complaint before the mandate, and F.A.A. has 9 said they're not going to extend the mandate; that everyone's 10 had five years, you know. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Going to ground everyone? 12 MR. KING: The problem is, technology is just 13 really -- 14 (Several people speaking at the same time.) 15 THE REPORTER: One at a time, please. 16 MR. GRIFFIN: It's not a grounding; it's a lack of 17 use in certain air spaces. You can't do -- 18 MR. KING: Their position on this is that they've 19 been -- people have been notified in advance. I mean, you've 20 had how many years so far now? Almost -- 21 MR. RIZO: ADS-B is -- well, it's been in the works 22 since the late '90's when they were testing it, and in the -- 23 in Alaska. 24 MR. KING: But, I mean, had the mandate for several 25 years. 56 1 MR. RIZO: Several years now. 2 MR. KING: So -- 3 MR. LIVERMORE: But there's been an equipment -- a 4 lack of technology, really. I mean, there's been a lot of 5 movement in the technology area, and it's just now becoming a 6 stable item that can be installed. 7 MR. KING: I think that's a valid -- valid -- okay. 8 MR. WOOD: The business will be there, is the 9 bottom line. 10 MR. LIVERMORE: Mm-hmm. 11 MR. RIZO: And what that does, it just -- the 12 avionics part of it is going to bring more airplanes in for 13 maintenance, and when you have to open up an airplane to 14 install this equipment, that's the time that you're doing 15 inspections and other minor or major inspections, and that's 16 what we're trying to focus on. 17 MR. KING: Okay. Well, thank you, Manuel. 18 MR. WOOD: Yeah, thank you. 19 MR. RIZO: Thank you. 20 MR. LIVERMORE: Do you work on any pistons in 21 avionics at all? 22 MR. RIZO: We do. I -- in Hondo, there's quite a 23 bit of airplanes that are based there, and we generally do 24 peta static tests and some installations or so on the 25 maintenance side of it, you know, because our -- our 57 1 specialty and our training has been in the jet aircraft and 2 King Airs, not piston aircraft. But we do know people that 3 do that. 4 MR. LIVERMORE: Mm-hmm. 5 MR. KING: Thank you. 6 MR. RIZO: Thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Corey, to answer your question, 8 I think the County's interested in going this direction, 9 depending on funding and things like that. 10 MR. WALTERS: Excellent. That's what we need to 11 grow the airport. 12 MAYOR PRATT: Yeah. 13 MR. KING: Look, like I told you, Tom, I think with 14 the economics -- I just ran the economics just a while ago. 15 They probably meet both of your parameters for return on 16 investment, I mean, from what I've been told in the past. I 17 mean, I think it's something that -- maybe we just need to 18 get some items together to get a business plan from Manuel, 19 and we'll get some actual numbers together. And there's 20 nothing better than just bringing it to the Council, and 21 bring it to the City, and throw it out there in the public 22 and let it be out -- you know, out, available for discussion. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's the way to do it. 24 MR. KING: I don't know why it's not -- the 25 airport's no different than any other part of the city and 58 1 the county as far as development goes. I mean -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Very good. 3 MR. KING: All right. Well, thank you very much. 4 MR. RIZO: Thank you. 5 MR. KENNEDY: Can I make a quick comment, since our 6 mayor was happy to bring it up? Our fuel price right now is 7 39 cents a gallon below Hondo's. 8 MAYOR PRATT: That's great. 9 MR. KENNEDY: Do your homework, Mayor. 10 MR. KING: Is this av fuel -- avgas? 11 MR. KENNEDY: 39 cents a gallon below Hondo's 12 posted price right now, yeah. 13 MR. KING: Thank you very much, Joey. 14 MAYOR PRATT: Good. 15 MR. KING: Appreciate it. All right. 16 MR. WOOD: One other comment I'd like to make is 17 that Joey, Kerrville Aviation, has a repair facility here, 18 but they're not for jets; they're for piston type. Am I 19 correct? 20 MR. KENNEDY: Pretty much, yeah. 21 MR. WOOD: So you wouldn't really have a conflict 22 at this point. 23 MR. HOLLENBEAK: I've been managing a Conquest the 24 last six months. We got to go somewhere else for -- they're 25 really not geared at that level, so there's definitely a 59 1 market for this here to give us more complete availability. 2 MR. KING: Okay. Anything else? None being heard, 3 Item 4D, new -- here's another development opportunity for 4 our airport. They're just coming out of the woodwork. New 5 T-hangars. Harry Ingram. 6 MR. INGRAM: That would be me. Well, we've had a 7 pretty exciting morning here. We got a lot going on. My 8 name is Harry Ingram. I have sat on the airport board in the 9 past, and I've been in the exact situation you have. We've 10 heard from Mooney today, where you guys are in partnership -- 11 MR. McKENZIE: Harry's our tenant; he's in the 12 office right across the hall. 13 MR. INGRAM: I'm an appraiser/broker. I work as an 14 expert witness for aviation assets. But during my tenure on 15 the airport board, I've found that we were in the exact 16 situation as this; we didn't have -- I mean, we didn't have 17 funds. We didn't have the authority, and we had a 18 county/city relationship. Now, the board members were 19 councilmen and -- what's the other one? 20 MAYOR PRATT: Commissioners. 21 MR. INGRAM: Commissioners. Is that the case here? 22 I don't know. 23 MR. LIVERMORE: No. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank goodness. 25 MAYOR PRATT: Thank goodness. 60 1 MR. WOOD: They're our bosses; we work for them. 2 MR. INGRAM: Okay. What happened is I had to 3 resign my position on the board in order to get some 4 T-hangars built in La Grange, Texas. La Grange, 5,000 people 5 live in this town, right? We didn't have a terminal building 6 or T-hangars. So, I was instrumental in getting the 90/10 7 for the terminal building, and then I resigned from the board 8 and privately funded the T-hangars. I had them filled before 9 they were even constructed. I took the leases, and we sold 10 it back to the county. Kind of crazy. But, anyway, what I 11 think we have here today is opportunity. Now, you guys are 12 at a position where it looks like this airport could really 13 take off. I was drawn here because of the Brinkman hangar. 14 I was told it was going to be available and I could build a 15 large aircraft sales operation. I do brokerage. I do not 16 mind having another broker on the field, because that's just 17 going to make more business for me, okay? But I got here, 18 and the hangar wasn't available. Now, I can't go out -- it's 19 just economically not feasible for me to build a building 20 that size and make it work just for aircraft sales. 21 So, what I want to propose today is maybe a roadmap 22 for you guys, and for Mr. Rizo here, that we all -- we all 23 know what the stock market looks like now; we've lost 2,000 24 points in the last two months. There's people -- investors 25 out there that are looking for opportunities, and you have 61 1 the opportunity here with a 30-year lease, okay? There's 2 nothing saying we couldn't take this hangar that he wants to 3 build to a private investor and say, "Hey, this is what we 4 want, and the City's willing to give the lease; he's willing 5 to make the payments." And, boom, it can happen that way 6 very fast. And that's -- we also have a banker in town who 7 has said to my face, "I want to invest in aviation." Okay? 8 So, that's -- either he's going to help me with aircraft 9 sales, and even buildings or whatever. The intention here 10 with building the new T-hangars is not to suck the revenue 11 from Joey, okay? 12 MR. KENNEDY: I have no problem with T-hangars. 13 MR. INGRAM: No, I know that, but I'm saying that 14 is not -- not the intention. 15 MR. KENNEDY: If I didn't have big corporate 16 hangars full of little airplanes, I could provide Mr. Rizo a 17 spot tomorrow. 18 MR. INGRAM: Amen. And I'm saying maybe we do a 19 group hug. And I don't know what the -- the lease is on this 20 end hangar down here, but it would be perfect for him. So, 21 if we can make -- 22 MR. KENNEDY: We've actually been talking about it 23 already. We're looking at all those options. The problem is 24 office space. 25 MR. INGRAM: Okay. Office space is hammer and 62 1 nails. 2 MR. KENNEDY: That's right. 3 MR. INGRAM: So, I mean, we just have to maybe look 4 at things a little bit different. But, anyway, I want to 5 bring to your attention today -- first of all, we go to the 6 table of contents. I'm requesting from the Airport Board to 7 build 14 T-hangars, okay? There's a map here -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What did you just say? 9 Requesting from the Airport Board -- 10 MR. INGRAM: That I build those. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, I didn't hear that you 12 build. 13 MR. INGRAM: Yes. Yes. Well, go to the next page; 14 this is the terms. Now, this -- the top section is who you 15 guys are, who I am, okay? I'm requesting a 30-year ground 16 lease to start maybe in a month, but actually commencing 17 May of 2016. I need the lease to take to my investors or 18 banker and say, "I've got a 30-year lease. This is an 19 opportunity. This is what I'm going to pay in interest." 20 And, boom, it's done. Worst case scenario, this project is 21 not that large; I can just do it here at the local bank, 22 okay? So, first thing is that the Airport Board -- I'm 23 requesting a 30-year lease, and I believe that's similar to 24 what you did with Brinkman. It's also similar to what's 25 available in the rest of the country, what all the airports 63 1 do, okay? The -- number three, the lease has to be fully 2 transferable. I am 60 years old. There's no way I'm going 3 to live out a 30-year lease, probably. It's not my intent to 4 be in the aviation T-hangar business, okay? So, if it's, you 5 know, 1 year, 10 years, 15 years, I may leave the lease to my 6 grandkids. I may sell it next year, okay? Just for profit. 7 That's the intent. So, the lease has to be fully 8 transferable. 9 Now, Item 4 I believe is the only sticking point 10 that we could actually talk about, and it's that the 11 County/City -- this airport would provide the ramp; that's 12 the apron around the T-hangar and the taxiway to get there. 13 You would provide that. Now, what makes this relationship 14 good is you guys have the assets. The city, you guys build 15 roads. So, that's what I'm asking, is that you guys would 16 build that and maintain it, because asphalt -- they say it's 17 good for 10 years; it's probably eight. I don't really know 18 what the figure is, but it's an ongoing maintenance deal 19 that, as far as someone leasing T-hangars, I don't really -- 20 I don't want to do that. So, that's kind of the sticking 21 point that you guys would have to talk about. And, you know, 22 we can -- we can have a group hug after the meeting. 23 MR. WALTERS: Excuse me one moment. You said 24 construction and maintenance, correct? 25 MR. INGRAM: Correct. 64 1 MR. WALTERS: Okay. It just says construction. 2 But -- 3 MR. INGRAM: Yes, and maintenance. 4 MR. WALTERS: Okay. 5 MR. INGRAM: I would be responsible for maintenance 6 of the T-hangars, including the leasing, collecting funds, 7 ground lease payments, electric bills, insurance, and 8 building maintenance. The building would look almost exactly 9 like you have here. We would use the same lighting fixtures. 10 It would just -- just look, you know, similar. 11 MR. LIVERMORE: Harry, in your list here of 12 leasing, collecting rents, et cetera, I don't see property 13 taxes. 14 MR. INGRAM: Property tax would be on us. 15 MR. LIVERMORE: Okay. 16 MR. KING: Harry, one question. The 11,500 17 square feet -- 550 square feet, is that the footprint of the 18 T-hangars? 19 MR. INGRAM: That's the footprint. 20 MR. KING: Of the T-hangars? 21 (Mr. Ingram nodded.) 22 MR. KING: And, therefore, you would only be asking 23 for a ground lease on the footprint? 24 MR. INGRAM: That's correct. 25 MR. KING: But we would be responsible for the 65 1 other -- 2 MR. INGRAM: Apron. 3 MR. KING: -- 11,000 feet, or apron also. Okay. 4 MR. INGRAM: Yeah. The -- the hangars you 5 gentlemen recently built here, they're 14 foot high, okay? 6 This set of hangars, I've got it at 12 foot high, and I'll 7 tell you the reason. There's only three aircraft -- because 8 we're limited by the width of the door, okay? This door is 9 41,8, and I believe your doors are 41,5 or something. So, 10 we're limited by the width. So, the heighth, there's only 11 three aircraft that will not fit in a 12-foot T-hangar. 12 That's the Cessna 340, the Aerostar 600, and the Beechcraft 13 Duke. Okay? Those are the three aircraft that will fit in 14 your hangar that will not fit in these. Now, there's -- on 15 the next page, there's another set of hangars. These are the 16 larger type. Bruce said, you know, we need bigger ones -- 17 what people call bigger. We just don't have them. So, this 18 is a -- a hangar that is 60 wide; the door is 60. It's 50 19 deep, and it's 16 tall, and that will put in a C90 King Air, 20 okay? And this is just single span, open span. It's just 21 four units, so the construction on this is -- is really not 22 a -- you know, it's not really that expensive. 23 MAYOR PRATT: So, you got 10 like we have now, plus 24 four? 25 MR. INGRAM: Plus four. The locations of these 66 1 hangars are entirely up to the board, because you have to 2 figure out the best utilization for your property. Ideally, 3 it would be up on the plain up there, back by where the fuel 4 tanks are. But the taxiways, you want to look for future 5 growth, because I can tell you in the last probably seven or 6 eight years, Fredericksburg has doubled their T-hangars, and 7 they're still growing. Most airports are in that same or 8 similar situation. Like you say, you keep building them; 9 they keep coming. You know, that's more -- that's more 10 people buying fuel. That will help Joey, so it's -- and it 11 just creates business. I would like one of these T-hangars. 12 I will lease it just to put some aircraft for sale in. I 13 have a commitment from another gentleman; one is leased. And 14 I've contacted -- a customer of mine in San Antonio does have 15 a C90. He said he'd bring it out here in a minute, so that 16 would only leave one left out of that. So, we're looking at 17 those two projects. 18 The next page is kind of the details where it says 19 Fulfab, Incorporated. I know you guys use Erect-A-Tube. In 20 my business, I travel, and I travel to aircraft hangars. I 21 do appraisals, so I'm in -- I'm in aircraft hangars all the 22 time. This particular company, they built over 10,000 23 buildings, and I've seen the quality of the work. It's -- I 24 would say it's very similar to the quality of your first set 25 of T-hangars down there. Now, you have sliding doors in 67 1 those, but the quality of that construction is excellent, you 2 know, and they have held up very good over time. These are 3 all bifold doors. I've included the figures in here, because 4 I -- 5 MR. LIVERMORE: "Bifold" meaning they go up like 6 our current -- 7 MR. INGRAM: Exactly. 8 MR. LIVERMORE: Yeah. 9 MR. INGRAM: The proposal includes -- everything in 10 here is exactly as you have it in yours, okay? But instead 11 of the two skylights in the front, this will have one 12 skylight on top, because it's more usable light. You know, 13 when you walk into a T-hangar and it has a skylight up here, 14 the light is very usable, to where when you walk into one 15 where it's on the sides, the -- it radiates to the back wall. 16 Now, these have to be replaced about every eight years, so 17 it's just -- just the cost of doing business. But, actually, 18 when you go in there, it really does make a difference, so -- 19 MR. WOOD: What has to be replaced every eight 20 years? 21 MR. INGRAM: The skylights. They're plastic or 22 something; I don't know. So, I've included in the actual 23 figures here. The kit there, $130,000. To have it put up 24 is 57. It can be done locally, or the company will do it, 25 okay? They'll send the people out here to do it. Of course, 68 1 everything is engineered to the state of Texas and to your 2 local city requirements. There's a general contractor fee. 3 Me, okay? That's just if I have to go to the bank; I got 4 some leverage. I don't have to put all my money on the 5 table. But, anyway, those are the total dollars. And if you 6 did -- you know, if you ran it out over 30 years, it's -- 7 wow, this guy could pay for this hangar and make 800,000 8 bucks. Well, that's the story I'll be taking out to 9 investors. And if you want to build this gentleman a hangar, 10 it can be done very fast. Ideally, it'd be better if you 11 guys did it, but if you want to create that business for 12 Mr. Rizo, we could do it very fast by just asking -- say, 13 "Hey, we got an airport board with the County and City; 14 everybody is on board. We're giving you a lease for 30 15 years, and it's transferable." You know, that's what people 16 want to hear and need to hear. 17 So, the -- the actual next page, this is your 18 lease. It's 10 pages, and it is your lease. I just put it 19 in here so you would have it as of record. I agree to all 20 the terms here, okay? There is no reason that you would have 21 to say, "Well, you can do this in this hangar, but you can't 22 do this in that hangar." So, it's just as of record. The 23 actual end of it is basically my history, which is more in 24 the aviation. My son has been in the self-storage business 25 for 30 years. He's built 63 projects. I've helped him, 69 1 general-contracted a lot of them. So, you know, we have the 2 ins and outs on how to do it, what not to do, how to do it 3 legally, and we've always come up to the point it's cheaper 4 to do it right the first time, and, you know, you don't have 5 any problems. So, it's -- that's -- that's my proposal. And 6 I guess -- does anybody have any questions? 7 MR. KING: So, your proposal is for -- it would be 8 either one of these facilities? 9 MR. INGRAM: Actually, it's for both. 10 MR. KING: Oh, for both. 11 MR. LIVERMORE: 14 units. 12 MR. KING: 14 total, okay. 13 MR. McKENZIE: Two different slabs. 14 MR. KING: All on the same -- all on the same 15 11,550-foot -- what's the total? 16 MAYOR PRATT: The 10 units. 17 MR. KING: That it would be an additional -- 18 additional 10,000 square feet -- 10,000? 19 MR. INGRAM: Yeah. And that does -- this -- this 20 figure is just for this one, okay. The actual figure for 21 just the four units would be about $60,000 cheaper. 22 MR. KING: So -- instead of the original, because 23 less walls. 24 MR. INGRAM: Less walls, less everything. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What you're asking the Airport 70 1 Board to do is basically commit to give you a lease so you 2 can take it out and shop it? 3 MR. INGRAM: Correct. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what you're asking right 5 now. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Land lease. 7 MR. KING: Land lease, right. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A spot for a land lease. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Land lease and a commitment 10 for the -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maintenance. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- taxiways. No, taxiways. 13 MR. INGRAM: Apron and taxiway. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 15 MR. KING: Well -- 16 MR. INGRAM: This process can be done to help this 17 gentleman. 18 MR. KING: Sure. 19 MR. WOOD: You could do a similar thing in that 20 type building that you can for T-hangars. 21 MR. INGRAM: Immediately. 22 MR. WOOD: That's another avenue for us to have 23 that facility. 24 MR. INGRAM: Right. But I do want -- I want the 25 board to know that I'm not here -- I'm an aircraft appraiser 71 1 and broker, okay? But I have made a commitment here to be 2 here for at least the next 10 years, okay? So, I want to 3 have an environment that makes it easier for me. We've got 4 some great maintenance -- what's the Dugosh -- what's his 5 name? James? James -- 6 MR. LIVERMORE: Gandy. 7 MR. INGRAM: -- Gandy. He's also -- he's retained 8 me to sell his aircraft. However, I've had a couple of 9 people call and want to pre-purchase inspections. You know, 10 he's more of a boutique aircraft, you know, maintenance shop. 11 He'll say $1,500, $2,000, where it's pretty much a $500 deal 12 anywhere you go in the country. I had a guy that I'm 13 representing that has a Mooney, and he wanted an annual, and 14 they told him 3,000 to 5,000 without even looking at it. So, 15 not -- and he does fantastic work. And Mooney owners are 16 kind of a notch above the Cessna/Piper guys. But we need -- 17 what I found myself is in a situation where we need an 18 annual -- if an airplane's out of annual, there's no way to 19 go; you have to get a ferry permit. It's a nightmare, okay? 20 So, we need a gentleman like him to come in and say, you 21 know, "Hey, I love to work on Hawkers, but I can work on a 22 Mooney." And I imagine you would. 23 MR. RIZO: I would. 24 MR. INGRAM: Yes. So -- and that's what we need. 25 MR. KING: Okay. Discussion? Okay. First of all, 72 1 Bruce, I don't know what the total apron required for this 2 facility is. Do you have any clue? 3 MR. McKENZIE: It would be approximately what the 4 size of that building is. 5 MR. KING: Double it, so 21,000 square feet. 6 MR. McKENZIE: We need about 70 feet on each side 7 of it -- 50 feet on each side of it, yeah. 8 MR. KING: There's two buildings or one building, 9 Harry? 10 MR. McKENZIE: Two buildings. 11 MR. INGRAM: Two buildings, but the second building 12 only has a front. 13 MR. McKENZIE: One side of it, talking about the 14 T-hangars. 15 MR. INGRAM: So it could be parked up -- 16 MR. McKENZIE: I didn't figure the square footage, 17 but I can. 18 MR. KING: That's what we need to know first, is 19 the square footage of the apron, 'cause I figure under this 20 thing, we're responsible for that. And then we need to know, 21 where are you going to build these things? Bruce? He left. 22 MR. LIVERMORE: You ran him off. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: He just took a shovel and went 24 out. 25 MAYOR PRATT: He had enough of your questions. 73 1 MR. KING: How do you get there from here? Because 2 I drive around the airport a lot, and haven't found a place 3 on this airport yet that doesn't require some infrastructure. 4 MR. INGRAM: I've kind of looked at the airport, 5 you know, where we have the fuel tanks, the storage tanks. I 6 would suggest the back side of the four units, back side 7 facing those fuel tanks, the taxiway going to the front, and 8 then the T-hangar coming out like this. And that leaves that 9 whole back open for continued growth. 10 MR. KING: Right. Right. 11 MR. GRIFFIN: Which is right in line with the 12 master plan. 13 MR. KING: Oh, yeah. 14 MR. WALTERS: Yeah. 15 MR. KING: Except for the ski ramp you have to get 16 up to the top, which is -- which is a taxiway. However, it's 17 not -- it's not built for aircraft at this moment. 18 MR. GRIFFIN: Right. 19 MAYOR PRATT: Bruce, is that going to change the -- 20 the sewer line, water line? 21 MR. McKENZIE: No, we're beyond -- 22 MAYOR PRATT: We're beyond that? Okay. All right. 23 Just want to make sure. 24 MR. GRIFFIN: It's north of that. 25 MR. KING: Okay. 74 1 MR. WALTERS: I think -- 2 MR. GRIFFIN: Right along the water -- the sewer 3 line. 4 MAYOR PRATT: But it comes across that field. 5 MR. GRIFFIN: It's -- yeah, still above that. 6 MR. KING: Yes, Mr. Walters? 7 MR. WALTERS: I was going to say, I think we 8 probably, since we're responsible for the apron and the 9 maintenance of it -- and I certainly appreciate your interest 10 in your project, but to kind of -- my initial thought of it 11 is if we're going to do all those things, we might as well 12 build a shell ourselves and -- 13 MAYOR PRATT: With 90/10 money. 14 MR. WALTERS: With 90/10 money. 15 MR. INGRAM: I agree. 16 MR. KING: I'll be right back. 17 MR. WALTERS: So, you know, if you came in and just 18 said, "Hey, I just want to lease a piece of dirt, and I'll be 19 responsible for everything else," then that's something I 20 think that, you know, we probably need to put a pencil to and 21 see if we're interested. 22 MR. INGRAM: Right. 23 MR. WALTERS: But for us to do -- and we had 24 actually a lot more infrastructure than maybe it appeared 25 with retaining walls and -- and moving some things over 75 1 there, and I think as we go further north or whatever, I 2 think that the situation gets even a little more involved, or 3 complex. And I think there's a lot more dirt and higher 4 retaining walls. So, I mean, I'm not saying we're not 5 interested. That's just my -- 6 MR. INGRAM: Sure. 7 MR. WALTERS: -- my initial thought as a board 8 member. I'd say if we're going to be responsible for all 9 those things, I think we might as well just do it all 10 ourselves. 11 MR. INGRAM: I agree. 12 MR. WOOD: Keep in mind, Harry, one of our primary 13 goals as the Airport Board is to generate income so we can be 14 revenue-neutral, and the City and County -- pay our own way, 15 and not have to have a budget item on their budgets to say, 16 "This is money we're giving to the airport." We can -- any 17 source of income, which T-hangars certainly are, -- 18 MR. INGRAM: Absolutely. 19 MR. WOOD: -- would be something I think we would 20 want to be owners of. 21 MR. INGRAM: Your 90/10 funding is not limitless. 22 There is a limit to it. 23 MR. WALTERS: Absolutely. 24 MR. INGRAM: You have to decide how it's spent. 25 MR. WOOD: And also, it's scheduled to -- 76 1 MR. INGRAM: You have a relationship here with the 2 County and City that, you have to admit, you guys could not 3 -- you see the picture on the front of that? It's flat, 4 okay? You guys can literally come in here in a day and knock 5 it out with the equipment you already own, okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's flat. I don't think it's 7 probably as flat as you think. 8 MAYOR PRATT: Not as flat as you think it is. 9 MR. INGRAM: I'm saying you have a relationship 10 here to get it done a lot cheaper than I can do it. 11 MR. WOOD: We got resources. 12 MR. KING: I would say I would propose the same 13 thing. I'll do the same thing. 14 MR. INGRAM: What's that? 15 MR. KING: I'll do your project. If I can get the 16 board to approve it, I'll do the project. 17 MR. INGRAM: You mean you'd fund it? 18 MR. KING: Sure. I can get Mr. Walters to probably 19 help me fund it also. I mean, what I'm saying is that the 20 revenue generated by your facility is $373 a month -- or, 21 excuse me, 300 -- 22 MR. INGRAM: 3,000. 23 MR. KING: It's $323 per month in revenue, is what 24 we get for 30 years. 25 MR. INGRAM: Oh, yeah. 77 1 MR. KING: For 30 years. Not counting the cost of, 2 I mean, increases over the years. So, we have basically 3 $3,600 a year, so over 10 years; we have about $36,000. 4 MR. LIVERMORE: You're talking about just on the 5 land rate, okay. 6 MR. KING: That's all you're going to get. You 7 don't get the cream; you just get -- 8 MAYOR PRATT: Then you got to add the property tax 9 back into that. 10 MR. KING: But we don't get property tax. I don't 11 get any property tax, so that's -- the City and the County 12 deals with that. But we got $36,000 in 10 years to fund 13 aprons and to maintain aprons on this facility. So, that's 14 why I asked for Bruce to give me the total -- 15 MR. McKENZIE: 35,000 square feet. 16 MR. KING: 35,000? 17 MR. McKENZIE: For both of those hangars. 18 MR. KING: You can do it for a buck a foot? 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't think so. 20 MAYOR PRATT: I don't think so either. 21 MR. McKENZIE: No way. 22 MR. KING: How much -- 23 MR. INGRAM: I didn't compare it to this last 24 project. I mean, we were -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Probably more complex. 78 1 MR. McKENZIE: We spent 80,000 for the last 2 project. 3 MR. INGRAM: Yeah, but look at all the dirt you 4 moved. You have to refer back to that picture. 5 MR. KING: We did get a lot of dirt. Harry, I'm 6 not pooh-poohing your idea or anything. I'm just saying we 7 don't have -- as an airport board, we can only deal with the 8 revenue available, okay? So we have 300 -- $323 a month in 9 revenue, so we have to make that revenue somehow fit what our 10 outgo is. In other words, we've looked at the same situation 11 with the Mooney paint hangar, okay? And we're going -- we 12 can adjust that in a minute. If it costs us $100,000 to fix 13 it up, we have to look at what revenue is available. It has 14 to make economical sense for the board to put the money 15 forth. I mean, even if we build aprons over there, we have 16 to buy the materials; we have to pay for the concrete. 17 MR. McKENZIE: $31,000 just for the hot mix, if we 18 get it laid for free. 19 MR. KING: That's if we get it laid for free; 20 $31,000 for hot mix that we've got to come up with out of our 21 pockets. So -- 22 MAYOR PRATT: You don't get it labor-free. What 23 you're really saying is if the City pays for it. 24 MR. INGRAM: Everybody knows that's labor-free. 25 MR. KING: So we now have a 100 -- a 96-month 79 1 payout on the hot mix, so it's going to take us 96 months to 2 pay out our hot mix, or 7.9 years to pay our hot mix out. 3 MR. INGRAM: That's about what it pays out on this. 4 MR. KING: If I pay out -- exactly. What I was 5 going to say, if the airport were to find the money from the 6 City and the County to build this facility for $469,000, is 7 what it would cost us to build a 16-unit facility -- the same 8 facility we built over here is $469,000. That pays out in 9 7.67 years. 10 MR. INGRAM: That's correct. 11 MR. KING: The hot mix pays out in 7.97. So, what 12 I'm saying is it's economically -- it's the same economics to 13 build the hangars -- the City/County/airport to build the 14 hangars as it is to lay hot mix over there for you. There's 15 no difference. So -- 16 MR. WALTERS: And we get the revenue. 17 MR. WOOD: And we get the revenue. 18 MR. KING: And we have a revenue source. We have a 19 revenue source, where we have no revenue -- well, we do have 20 a small revenue source. In other words, what it would take 21 to pay back the 35,000 in hot mix would take the same amount 22 of time to pay back the actual construction of the T-hangars. 23 So, just pointing those things out, because we -- we look at 24 it as -- we have to look at it as a revenue -- as putting 25 money out, and what do we get back? 80 1 MR. INGRAM: The question is, will you guys do it? 2 Okay? And I know; I've sat on the boards, and the same 3 things keep coming up. "Well, if we do this, we're not going 4 to be able do this. If we do this..." You know, maybe our 5 money's invested more in helping him. So, it's up to you 6 guys. 7 MR. KING: It's a valid question. That's a valid 8 question, Harry. I'm -- you know, I'm not -- 9 MR. WOOD: We got to evaluate the options -- the 10 option. 11 MR. KING: I look -- I think we have to look at the 12 project. I think what the project shows you right here is 13 how much the difference in construction costs are for an 14 individual -- 15 MR. INGRAM: That's what I'm here for. 16 MR. KING: -- and the State of Texas. If you have 17 one built through the State of Texas, it costs -- 16 18 T-hangars cost how many dollars? 19 MR. McKENZIE: 801,000. 20 MR. KING: 801,000. You can build the same hangar 21 with the same exact amount of input that we put into it. We 22 built the apron on this; we built the aprons. You can put 23 the same thing down for 400 -- $467,000. 24 MR. INGRAM: Yeah. 25 MR. KING: Versus 800,000, so that's -- that's 81 1 working through the State. That's your tax dollars at work. 2 MR. INGRAM: That's why I'm saying if you introduce 3 a partnership, -- 4 MR. KING: Right. 5 MR. INGRAM: -- you get things done. 6 MR. KING: Sure. 7 MR. INGRAM: And so you get these two buildings 8 done; by May, they're built and filled. Maybe this 9 building's built and filled by May of next year. Now, can 10 you guys actually do that? 11 MR. KING: Would you be interested in giving us a 12 royalty our your revenue stream? 13 MR. INGRAM: No. 14 MAYOR PRATT: You know where I was going. 15 MR. KING: I mean -- 16 MR. INGRAM: No, 'cause I'm selling the project, 17 okay? 18 MR. KING: I know. 19 MAYOR PRATT: He's already told us he's going to 20 flip it. 21 MR. KING: I already said I'll build the project; 22 I'll build it with my own funds. 23 MR. INGRAM: You and I can sit down; you can just 24 buy me out, and do you not have to -- 25 MR. KING: I'm saying it's economically feasible. 82 1 I think that if we did this project, -- 2 MR. INGRAM: Right. 3 MR. KING: -- the Airport Board does the project, I 4 think we might have a line of people in here a mile and a 5 half long building the next 35 T-hangars, because it's a very 6 advantageous financial -- 7 MR. INGRAM: That's the idea. 8 MR. KING: -- financial project. 9 MR. HOLLENBEAK: When I came here two years ago, 10 you had 11 people waiting; now you got 14. And 11 Fredericksburg, you said, just did that there, and they have 12 nothing available. There's people waiting up there, so 13 there's definitely a need. And once that's built, that's 14 growth. 15 MR. KING: I think we just have to discuss it a 16 little bit as a board. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- 18 MR. KING: What do y'all think? Y'all are not 19 talking much. 20 MR. LIVERMORE: You were on a roll. 21 MR. WOOD: I agree with everything you said. 22 MR. LIVERMORE: I agree with everything you just 23 said. I'm the next on the agenda, and everything that I 24 almost got here has been said. 25 MR. WOOD: I think we need to treasure our revenue 83 1 sources here. And as much as we can -- I understand what 2 Harry's saying, that we can only do it -- you know, so many 3 in such amount of time, because our 90/10 money is not -- 4 MR. INGRAM: Limited. 5 MR. WOOD: -- not there when we want it. So -- 6 MR. WALTERS: I'm going to bring up something. I'd 7 like to see if we couldn't have a couple of board members get 8 with the City and County and say, you know, "We've got some 9 projects here that we'd like to talk to y'all about getting 10 some funding for." 11 MR. LIVERMORE: Absolutely. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The door's open. 13 MR. WOOD: I can't think of a better way for that 14 E.I.C. money to be spent as far as return back to the 15 community. 16 MR. KING: Harry, your project -- I don't want to 17 make it sound like I'm just pooh-poohing your project on this 18 deal, but I will say that if you were responsible for the 19 aprons -- the construction of the aprons, and you were 20 responsible for the project, -- 21 MR. INGRAM: Right. 22 MR. KING: -- I'd be a lot more interested. 23 MR. INGRAM: Sure, I know you would. And it's 24 the -- there's airports around the country -- 25 MR. KING: Because then my $323 a month is real 84 1 money; it comes back to us. 2 MR. INGRAM: You know, there's more airports in 3 Texas than there is in all of Europe, okay? 4 MR. McKENZIE: That's right. 5 MR. INGRAM: The investment projects, it doesn't 6 matter what airport you go to, the City/County, they will 7 always take this on. Because what's going to happen is 8 you're going to -- you're going to have -- "Hey, you know, 9 you should have sealed that last year." And the airport -- 10 you've got a beautiful facility, and you need to have your 11 hands on that, keeping it beautiful. You don't want me tied 12 up in a lease saying, "Hey, I'm not going to put a new apron 13 on it. The holes are only 6 inches deep right now." 14 MR. WALTERS: But that's the difference. That's 15 where we go to our lease. We have obligations in the lease 16 which require you to do these things, and if you don't, then 17 we can do them and bill you for them. 18 MR. INGRAM: Okay. I'm -- 19 MR. KING: But the other -- 20 MAYOR PRATT: What he's proposing here is -- is 21 basically a 3P. 22 MR. INGRAM: And what is that? 23 MAYOR PRATT: A public/private -- 24 MR. INGRAM: Exactly. 25 MAYOR PRATT: -- partnership. That's what he's 85 1 proposing. 2 MR. INGRAM: That makes things happen. 3 MR. KING: It does. 4 MAYOR PRATT: The difference is that is in a 5 typical public/private partnership, he's keeping the revenue, 6 and the Airport board -- 7 MR. INGRAM: Wait a minute. I'm also keeping the 8 risk. I've got $250,000 out there, and just because you say 9 we have 14 people on the list doesn't mean they're actually 10 going to do it. There's risk involved. 11 MR. KING: I agree. I agree with that. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seems to me that what you're 13 proposing, you threw out something, and there's lots of -- 14 there's a lot of negotiation potential between who pays for 15 the -- and maintains the apron. And I don't -- you know -- 16 MR. INGRAM: I said that would be the sticking 17 point. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Y'all need to say, "Hey, can 19 you make it work?" 20 MR. WALTERS: I think, as I said earlier, if you're 21 just coming in saying, "You know what? I just want to lease 22 a raw piece of dirt as-is," then we're very interested. But, 23 you know, for us to take on, you know, all the expense and 24 the payout, I just don't see that it makes economic sense for 25 us, unless we really feel like there is such a need here and 86 1 we have no other means in which to get it done. 2 MR. INGRAM: I understand. 3 MR. KING: We've done this in the past. This is 4 not something new. 5 MR. INGRAM: I understand. 6 MR. KING: The Friedkin hangar -- the Friedkin 7 hangar down here is a perfect example. We provided them with 8 an apron; they provided the building, and we receive $200 a 9 month. 10 MS. DUNGAN: 486. 11 MR. KING: What is it? 12 MS. DUNGAN: 486. 13 MR. KING: That's right, $486 a month. And they 14 provide no revenue -- they generate no revenue for this 15 airport other than $400 a month. It's basically a hangar 16 that never -- maybe it gets opened up once every month. 17 MR. INGRAM: I'm going to generate revenue. 18 MR. KING: So we have no -- no upside there at all. 19 There's no upside. We provided them with a beautiful ramp, 20 and look at it now. Look what happened. We get $400 a 21 month. Now, we had that ramp paid for, so that's $400 in 22 profit, so we profit every month off of that $400, but we had 23 no outgo. 24 MR. INGRAM: I heard a comment this morning saying 25 how many people will come in -- you know, they bring 87 1 opportunities, but you don't have the infrastructure to 2 provide to them. 3 MR. KING: Right. 4 MR. INGRAM: Okay? And I don't know how long this 5 board's been sitting here doing this, but the opportunities 6 have been coming to you. They've been coming over phone 7 calls; they've been coming in presentations, and it hasn't 8 happened, all right? You've got a beautiful airport, 9 probably the nicest terminal building in Texas. And, you 10 know, you guys -- I applaud you for that. But this airport 11 is seen as a storage only airport. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't accept that. Look at 13 Mooney. Look at Mooney out there. 14 MR. INGRAM: Well, I'm not talking about 15 manufacturing. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Look at the Brinkman hangar. 17 MAYOR PRATT: I want to come to the defense of this 18 board. This board has done a great job -- 19 MR. INGRAM: I'm saying they have done a great job, 20 but there's opportunities missed. 21 MR. KING: There is -- I agree, we have missed 22 opportunities, Harry. I will tell you that that hangar is a 23 perfect example, that hangar they built down there. If they 24 would have been required to build that hangar in the back 25 where you'd like to build, the infrastructure for your 88 1 facility would be here today. 2 MR. INGRAM: Correct. 3 MR. KING: In other words, if they would have 4 spent -- if we would have asked them to spend the money for 5 infrastructure back there and abate their rent, -- 6 MR. INGRAM: I would have leased the Brinkman 7 hangar. 8 MR. KING: -- then we would be talking to you about 9 building on the existing piece of property that had 10 infrastructure. So, there have been mistakes made in the 11 past, and -- but those are things that -- water under the 12 bridge. But as a board, we have to look at the economic 13 impact of your project and what our outgo is. And like 14 Mr. Walters said, you know, if there was some modification 15 made here as far as, like, the cost that the Airport Board is 16 having to put into this thing, then, you know, projects like 17 this are feasible. But Mr. Rizo is -- is offering to bring 18 us jobs and a service, okay? 19 MR. INGRAM: That -- and that will bring more jobs 20 and more services. 21 MR. KING: T-hangars bring us revenue when we build 22 them. 23 MR. INGRAM: Well, T-hangars also bring you 24 aircraft owners with different available skills. 25 MR. KING: And about half of them sit in their 89 1 hangar and store their airplane. 2 MR. McKENZIE: The average piston airplane burns, 3 on the average, about 450 gallons a year, about $40 a year in 4 revenue in flowage fees. I think your -- 5 MR. KING: I bought 400 gallons last week. 6 MR. LIVERMORE: I was going to say, I buy 400 a 7 month. 8 MR. KING: I bought 400 gallons last week from 9 Mr. Kennedy, and I'll buy another 400 gallons this Friday. 10 So -- 11 MR. KENNEDY: In your Cub? 12 MR. KING: Not in my Cub, in my jet. But what -- 13 but what I'm saying is, part of the -- the thing with 14 T-hangars is you end up with a lot of aircraft that Joey 15 has -- Mr. Kennedy has parked down in this hangar down here 16 that don't fly. I mean, you have -- probably have -- I bet 17 you have -- if you did a percentage basis of your piston 18 aircraft, how many percent fly and how many don't fly? 19 MR. KENNEDY: Oh, I know exactly what those numbers 20 are. I mean, it's roughly about -- right now, it's probably 21 60 percent. 22 MR. KING: That don't fly? 23 MR. KENNEDY: Anybody else would have kicked those 24 airplanes out and been moving Mr. Rizo in right now, but I 25 don't like to do business that way. 90 1 MR. INGRAM: That's a way to do business. You 2 know, if -- maybe if he moves those T-hangars together to -- 3 MR. KENNEDY: Well, yeah. 4 MR. INGRAM: -- pull these people over there, 5 and -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: As long as -- 7 MR. KENNEDY: It's not like the board's been 8 delinquent in trying to filling that need. They just 9 finished building a set of T-hangars. 10 MR. KING: We work within our revenue source. 11 That's what we do; we work within the revenue. We are 12 mandated by -- by our two owners to try to get this airport 13 to revenue-neutral. 14 MR. INGRAM: Sure. 15 MR. KING: And, you know, we feel like we're on the 16 road to that. And -- 17 MAYOR PRATT: We've gone from -- we've gone from 18 $400,000 to $30,000. $30,000, so that's almost neutral 19 already. 20 MR. KING: Revenue sources are very important to 21 us. And so I'm not saying that I wouldn't do your deal. My 22 personal -- but it would need a little bit of massaging. 23 MR. INGRAM: Well, this -- 24 MR. KING: I think there's probably revenue 25 available. 91 1 MR. INGRAM: This is our meet and greet. You know, 2 if you're willing to finance it, Steve, that's my deal, is I 3 want to go to somebody, a local banker, and who's pretty much 4 said he will do the deal. 5 MR. KING: Yeah. 6 MR. INGRAM: But I want to take a clean deal, "This 7 is it." Not one that says, "Oh, every eight years, you got 8 to go back and do this." You got to go back and do the -- 9 MR. KING: Let me be very clear. When I said I'd 10 finance that same deal, what I meant was I don't think 11 there's any shortage of people available who would not put up 12 the money. 13 MR. INGRAM: Right. 14 MR. KING: We've had people come to us. People 15 have come to do T-hangar projects. We've seen them, but 16 those T-hangar projects stood on their own completely. They 17 didn't require any public money input, no public -- 18 private/public partnership. There was nothing involved 19 there. It was -- we had one down over here, but the cost 20 when they did that -- the cost of it takes the payout from 21 7.67 to 10, 11 years when they start putting all that other 22 in there, and so they've all fallen by the wayside. So, you 23 know, when I made that comment, I hope you understand, I 24 meant that I think there's probably multiple people, and I 25 could probably pick up the phone right now and call them; 92 1 they would fund that same project just like you did. 2 MR. INGRAM: Sure. 3 MR. KING: Because it's a very advantageous -- it's 4 a 7.6-year payout. That's a fairly good payout, on a 30-year 5 lease especially. 6 MR. WOOD: Did I hear another option for RizoJet as 7 being Hangar Number 4? Did Joey say -- 8 MS. DUNGAN: He'll be right back. 9 MR. WOOD: -- if there were new T-hangars, he could 10 take all his small aircraft -- 11 MR. LIVERMORE: Did you hear that? 12 MR. WOOD: I just wanted to make that clear. 13 MAYOR PRATT: He just said that's not the way he 14 does business. 15 MR. WOOD: He couldn't do it unless -- but if he 16 had a T-hangar to put those airplanes in, then that would be 17 something available in short order. 18 MR. LIVERMORE: Joey has been -- for years, for 19 five, six, seven years, has pitched the construction of more 20 T-hangars for -- to remove -- to give the pistons another 21 place to go so he would have an opportunity to bring in more 22 large -- 23 MR. WOOD: I know that, but my point was that 24 Hangar 4 could be an option for RizoJet. 25 MR. KING: And I think there are some discussions 93 1 about that right now. 2 MR. RIZO: Yes. 3 MR. KING: Okay. Thank you very much, Harry. 4 We're going talk about it. We're going to get some numbers 5 together, find out what it costs for our part of it, and then 6 we'll take a look at it. 7 MR. INGRAM: All right. 8 MR. WOOD: Nice presentation. 9 MR. INGRAM: Thanks. 10 MR. WALTERS: Thank you. 11 MAYOR PRATT: Thank you. 12 MR. KING: All right. Next? 13 MR. WALTERS: Mr. Livermore. 14 MR. KING: 4E, airport restaurant and turbine 15 maintenance facility. 16 MR. LIVERMORE: I want to compliment everyone in 17 this room, because you all have stolen almost all of my 18 thunder. I was talking about -- 19 MR. WOOD: Well, if you're going to build that, we 20 don't even need to talk about it. 21 MR. LIVERMORE: Right. (Laughter.) 22 MAYOR PRATT: Just go to the next item. 23 MR. LIVERMORE: It -- but, anyway, just like the 24 mayor said, this board has made incredible strides to become 25 revenue-neutral in the past three to four years. Back at 94 1 that time, we were requiring subsidies from each the County 2 and the City of roughly somewhere between 200,000, 225,000, 3 230,000 -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: $200,000 each. 5 MR. LIVERMORE: -- a year. 6 MAYOR PRATT: 400,000. 7 MR. LIVERMORE: So, this -- and in the new budget, 8 we're down -- what is it, 35,000 each? 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yes, sir, 70,000. 10 MR. LIVERMORE: 70,000 total, so that's a big, 11 gigantic annual savings. It's like an annuity to the City 12 and the County. Credit goes to a lot of people, including 13 our wonderful customers, our two owners who have been very 14 supportive, our Airport Manager and Steve King and this 15 board. We've achieved this change by cutting a lot of 16 expenses and raising revenues. Both sources under current 17 circumstances, and we've kind of commented about that this 18 morning, are pretty well close to tapped out. I think we 19 can -- through some diligence, we can probably, at the 20 margins, trim expenses more, but we're about there on cost 21 cutting. With regard to revenue, we're tapped out. We have 22 everything rented. There's -- other than the new ideas, if 23 we don't do something new, we're at our max there. We're 24 rich in real estate, and there's obviously demand. We've got 25 a lot of growth in this area with James Avery, new jobs 95 1 coming in. There's going to be more. Success begets 2 success. 3 We have one new maintenance facility that's been 4 proposed. We badly need a turbine facility on this airport. 5 And though we're land rich, obviously, we're building poor. 6 We have no space for new business for anything like that. 7 I'm trying to skip through this, 'cause a lot of this has 8 already been talked about. I wish I had been first on the 9 agenda. The T-hangar business, again, we know there's a lot 10 of demand. We have opportunities to build more. I basically 11 am of the opinion that we should be in the landlord business, 12 not just the ground leasing business, because that's where 13 the revenue is. The big reason that I'm trying to make some 14 comments here today, though, crystallized about a month or 15 six weeks ago while I was thinking about what can we do to 16 raise revenues? I think in addition to the things that we've 17 discussed today, T-hangars and a turbine facility, we should 18 also look for a restaurant opportunity here on the airport. 19 I fly around the country a lot. I'm not one of the 20 400-gallon a year, or whatever it was, users, and I just made 21 a trip in my plane to Seattle. I just got back from 22 Colorado. I always enjoy using airports where there's a 23 restaurant, because it makes for a nice break. I ran into 24 Curt at Fredericksburg here -- when was that, about a month 25 ago? 96 1 MR. HOLLENBEAK: At the restaurant. 2 MR. LIVERMORE: At the restaurant. And we have -- 3 we have a -- I think a wonderful way to not only create 4 another revenue source as a landlord, but we also have an 5 opportunity of a restaurant to create a tighter bond between 6 the people of the city and county and the airport, because a 7 lot of people would come here, just like they do in 8 Fredericksburg and Port Townsend, Washington, where I was, 9 and 25 other places, and use the airport, because it becomes 10 kind of a social center. I think a great location for a 11 restaurant would be where the fuel farm is, which also is 12 probably a great turbine facility, but maybe these can be 13 married together in the same -- in the same building if we 14 just think innovatively. I'm -- I'm hopeful that someone 15 like Manuel Rizo and Harry will come forward with ideas for 16 us on a restaurant. One of the reasons I'm hoping is that 17 these aren't concrete ideas; they're just my thoughts and 18 other people's thoughts on this board. And I think if people 19 in the community know that we're open to this type of an 20 idea, that someone will come to us with a proposal. 21 And so I'm just really encouraged at this meeting 22 this morning, because every -- just about our entire 23 discussion has been about opportunity, and not about 24 problems. We're very blessed, and I think that beyond even a 25 needed maintenance facility, needed more aircraft storage 97 1 buildings, that we ought to also think of a food facility. 2 We were up at Fredericksburg that day, Curt, and we bumped 3 into each other. There was at least about 50 airplanes tied 4 down up there that were in and out, in and out, in and out 5 while we were sitting there. Some would fire up, take off, 6 and other ones would replace it. People were coming there to 7 have lunch, have breakfast, whatever. 8 MR. HOLLENBEAK: There was a line at the door. 9 MR. LIVERMORE: And a line at the door. And I 10 think that we have that kind of opportunity here also, to be 11 a place where a lot of folks will fly in to eat, et cetera. 12 It just creates more vitality to our airport. So, that's the 13 sum -- that's what I have in mind, Mr. Chairman. Appreciate 14 the opportunity. 15 MR. KING: You bet. Well, thank you, Ed. I hope 16 that you've built some interest for this, and hopefully -- 17 MR. LIVERMORE: I think you were up there the day 18 after I was. 19 MR. KING: Yeah, I was, exactly. It's a great 20 facility, and I think there is -- there is a need for this. 21 We just have to find the right -- right vendor, and someone 22 that can put some numbers together, tell us what works -- 23 works for us. Any other discussion on this? Item 4F, letter 24 of interest. I don't know what this is. Do you know, Bruce? 25 MR. McKENZIE: Sure, I put it on there. I'd like 98 1 to visit with the board about what your thoughts were, and 2 I'm going to recommend that we do this. It's to send TexDOT 3 a letter of interest, but I wasn't going to do it without 4 your permission, to get in the queue again for another set of 5 new T-hangars like we had, the ones -- like the ones we just 6 completed in October, as well as possibly to overlay Taxiway 7 Echo, which is the taxiway that parallels the apron here. 8 Corey and I had a conversation about this last month. To get 9 into that queue, it's going to -- we're in about a three-year 10 swing right now to get into that. Here, what needs to be -- 11 we need to bear this in mind as we move forward. Our 12 non-primary entitlement funds, of which we receive $150,000 a 13 year, we now have $150,000 banked since last October the 1st. 14 If you don't use -- 15 MR. LIVERMORE: How readily is that money available 16 to us? 17 MR. McKENZIE: It's available right now. It's in 18 the bank. 19 MR. LIVERMORE: Our bank? 20 MR. McKENZIE: No, it's in their bank. Their bank. 21 MR. LIVERMORE: But it's available to us; we can 22 draw on it right now? 23 MR. McKENZIE: That's -- yes, sir, that's correct. 24 However, every four years -- which means we would have a 25 total of $600,000. If we don't utilize that, every four 99 1 years, then it rolls out of our account, and we start -- we 2 start over again. 3 MR. LIVERMORE: Does it roll out incrementally? 4 MR. McKENZIE: No, you lose the $600,000. Then in 5 the next fiscal year, you start again. 6 MR. LIVERMORE: And we have 150 right now? 7 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 8 MR. LIVERMORE: So we've got three years to go. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 10 MR. KING: What can these funds be used for? 11 MR. McKENZIE: We can use those for any type of 12 capital improvements on our airport; hangars, paving, aprons. 13 If we need to build a building, we can build a building with 14 it, that type of situation. But we -- we've got to get in 15 the queue to do that. 16 MR. KING: But they're like -- so if you had 17 300,000, you could build a $300,000 facility? 18 MR. McKENZIE: No, what we could -- 19 MR. KING: We pay 10 percent of that. 20 MR. McKENZIE: We could build another $800,000 set 21 of T-hangars, and it'd just cost us $80,000. 22 MR. KING: And that 80 would come -- 23 MR. McKENZIE: That would come out of the rest of 24 that money. 25 MR. KING: The non-entitlement? 100 1 MR. McKENZIE: Mm-hmm. 2 MR. KING: That money, so that's how that works. 3 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 4 MR. KING: So, if you had 600,000, that 600,000 5 would go towards an $800,000 project? 6 MR. McKENZIE: That's correct. 7 MR. KING: If you had 400,000 and you wanted to 8 build -- if you wanted -- 300,000, and you wanted to build a 9 $300,000 project, that 300 would go into that, but you still 10 have to pay 30 out of that. 11 MR. McKENZIE: Out of yours, yes, sir. That's 12 correct. 13 MR. WOOD: When is the earliest we could build more 14 T-hangars? 15 MR. McKENZIE: Three years from now. 16 MR. KING: Why don't we build a hangar for him? 17 MR. McKENZIE: We can do that. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can do you that right now? 19 MR. LIVERMORE: Oh, can we do that? 20 MR. KING: If we get in the queue, we have to build 21 it up four years or something. 22 MR. GRIFFIN: Why don't you go and get in the queue 23 now for the T-hangars, and then do what you want to do with 24 that -- 25 MR. KING: What if you had -- let's say next 101 1 year -- when would we get another 150? Next year? 2 MR. McKENZIE: This time next year, we'll have 3 300,000. 4 MR. KING: What if you had, next year, 300,000. 5 When do you have to get -- when do you have to dedicate this 6 money to a project? Like, let's say you wanted to build a 7 hangar, a 10,000 square foot hangar, or 12,000 square foot 8 hangar, for $300,000. When would you have to get -- when 9 would you have to make that commitment or proposal? 10 MR. McKENZIE: You need to put it in a letter now 11 that that's possibly what you want to do. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I thought we were already in 13 the queue for -- 14 MR. McKENZIE: We pulled that out, because -- 15 MAYOR PRATT: Why? 16 MR. McKENZIE: We pulled it because it was going to 17 cost us an exorbitant amount of money and time to redo this 18 runway and this taxiway -- parallel taxiway, as well as 19 Taxiway Echo. It was going to take two and a half years to 20 do that. 21 MR. WOOD: So we were in line to do the taxiway 22 revamp and all this, not to build T-hangars? 23 MR. McKENZIE: Not to build T-hangars. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I thought we were already in 25 the queue for that as far as -- 102 1 MAYOR PRATT: Oh, I thought we were back in the 2 queue. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm with Jack; I thought we 4 were -- 5 MR. McKENZIE: We were in it to just -- that's 6 correct. 7 MR. GRIFFIN: No, we decided to put it off so that 8 we could do the repaving of 3/21, -- 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I see. So, the decision was 10 not -- 11 MR. GRIFFIN: -- and bring it out, and the next 12 time we have money in the queue, then we could go back and do 13 the T-hangars. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, got you. 15 MR. GRIFFIN: We chose to fund the repaving of 3/21 16 this fall. That -- 17 MR. WOOD: That's when we should have got back in 18 the queue. 19 MR. GRIFFIN: That's when we pulled it out. That 20 was only a month ago. 21 MAYOR PRATT: Who's "we," though? Was it the 22 board's action, or -- 23 MR. GRIFFIN: The board. We sat here and discussed 24 it right here. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 103 1 MR. GRIFFIN: So, yeah, that was only a month ago. 2 So, I mean, last month we all agreed to go hire -- 3 MAYOR PRATT: Must have been in executive session. 4 MR. GRIFFIN: No, it was not. 5 MR. WALTERS: Special meeting. 6 MAYOR PRATT: Special meeting, oh. 7 MR. GRIFFIN: But -- yeah. So, that's what 8 happened. That was 30 days ago. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 10 MR. GRIFFIN: So this is -- this is -- 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You answered my question. 12 MR. GRIFFIN: Yeah. This is the -- okay. We've 13 got our N.P.E. coming up. What are we going to spend it on? 14 MR. WOOD: So we're timely? 15 MR. GRIFFIN: This is the next step, yeah. 16 MR. KING: So, Bruce, can you make two proposals? 17 Can you make -- 18 MR. McKENZIE: Sure we can. 19 MR. KING: Can you get in the queue for T-hangars, 20 and also for an up to 12,000 square foot building? 21 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, we can. We can ask them 22 for whatever we think we need, but we've got to get in line. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But you also have -- go back 24 to the available funds now. You could build the 12,000 25 square foot hangar next year. 104 1 MR. GRIFFIN: We've got half of it. We'd have to 2 wait till next year. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's what I said, you wait. 4 You got half of it now, and you got half of it next year. 5 MR. KING: Maybe we could. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Doesn't sound like a bad deal. 7 MR. LIVERMORE: How long is this queue you have to 8 get in? If we get in for the 12,000-foot building, are we 9 talking about 2025 or -- 10 MR. McKENZIE: Three years. 11 MR. KING: Why three years? What's the three 12 years? 13 MR. McKENZIE: That's the line that our -- our 14 airport planner told me two years ago that if we got in it 15 right now, she said, we're in year three right now. 16 MR. KING: Before they can approve projects that 17 are put in today? 18 MR. McKENZIE: Before they'll fund it. 19 MR. GRIFFIN: Before they'll fund their 90 percent. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you really can't get it for 21 three years. 22 MR. KING: Can't really get it. Is there any 50/50 23 money available? They used to have 50/50 grants. 24 MR. McKENZIE: Not -- not right now, but I can go 25 quiz them again. 105 1 MR. KING: 50/50 might be less popular than 90/10. 2 And -- 3 MAYOR PRATT: Really? 4 MR. KING: Well, might be. Probably would be. So, 5 I know they used to have 50/50 available for hangars also. 6 They had some 50/50 money, which, you know, while not as 7 advantageous as 90/10, 50/50 is a -- it cuts your payout in 8 half, so you end up back down in five years instead of 10 9 years on a -- on the 90/10 money. So, I mean, 100 -- a zero 10 percent. 11 MR. LIVERMORE: Bruce, is the three years 12 predicated or caused by TexDOT just not being able to work 13 through the list of applicants, or is it caused by the lack 14 of federal trust funds coming to them? 15 MR. McKENZIE: It's the domino effect. It's coming 16 from -- it's legislated in Washington, then it comes through 17 the F.A.A. Then us being a block grant state, which there 18 are only 10 block grant states, we get our block of money 19 sent to TexDOT Aviation. Then they ferret out the money as 20 they deem necessary, so -- 21 MR. WOOD: Based on the applications. 22 MR. McKENZIE: And who's next in line, yes, sir. 23 Yeah, that's how -- that's why there's a three-year -- or a 24 three-year outlook right now. 25 MR. WOOD: I think we need to try to figure out the 106 1 earliest possibility of having space provided for RizoJet, 2 whichever way we do it. 3 MAYOR PRATT: I would suggest you do both at the 4 same time. You always can make that adjustment as time goes 5 by, and here's why. If you have -- if you've got a 6 three-year window, with the problems that are going around in 7 the state of Texas with water and those type things, and 8 cities are now becoming -- and counties are becoming a little 9 money-tight, some of them -- somebody may say, "Oops, we want 10 to hold back on that and not do it," and that may move us up 11 in the queue. 12 MR. WOOD: I don't know that we can wait on TexDOT 13 90/10 money. I think we ought to investigate other avenues 14 like E.I.C. to -- 15 MR. KING: I agree. 16 MR. WOOD: -- try to make this happen. 17 MAYOR PRATT: We're not disagreeing there. I'm 18 just saying that basically Bruce's request is he wants 19 authority from you guys to go ahead and put it in the queue. 20 MR. LIVERMORE: I don't think we should do that. 21 MAYOR PRATT: And that's basically what he's 22 looking for. I'd say go ahead and put them both in the 23 queue. 24 MR. KING: I don't think it would hurt, but could 25 you investigate the 50/50 money? You might be -- you might 107 1 find a little shorter line there. 2 MR. McKENZIE: There's one more avenue that we may 3 be able to pursue with paving this Taxiway Echo, and we won't 4 know till we complete paving this little Mooney project that 5 we're going to be doing for them once the roof project is 6 complete. Y'all are all aware of that, that we're going to 7 do a little paving over there? We may very well have enough 8 funds left at that point to buy the hot mix to pave this 9 taxiway. And that is not -- this is not a major job. This 10 is two saw cuts on the end of a straight line, and lay 11 2 inches of hot mix. We can buy the hot mix, if we can get 12 our owner that owns the lay-down machine to lay it for us, 13 and we can -- we can do that. The reason we can do that is 14 because we might have enough money in our RAMP grant funds 15 this year. It's going to be close, but we may be able to 16 pull it off. 17 MAYOR PRATT: You're running out of time because of 18 the temperature changes, too. 19 MR. McKENZIE: Well, that's true, but you can lay 20 hot mix -- TexDOT Item 340 says I can lay hot mix when the 21 ambient air temp is 50 degrees and rising, so I've laid hot 22 mix in January before if it's -- 23 MAYOR PRATT: If it's up there. 24 MR. McKENZIE: If you get an Indian summer day, you 25 can do that. 108 1 MAYOR PRATT: That's right. 2 MR. KING: Okay. That's a good -- okay. I would 3 -- so I would -- do we need to make a motion for this? 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me ask a question. Going 5 back to the getting in the queue, is there any down side? 6 MR. McKENZIE: No, I don't see any down side. 7 MR. GRIFFIN: Well, we pulled this -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: If there's no down side, do 9 it. 10 MR. GRIFFIN: Other than the starting and stopping 11 with TexDOT, and what their -- what it involves in Austin and 12 our friends over there. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And there's another thing with 14 getting in the queue for 90/10. You get in the queue, but 15 you don't know if 90/10 money is going to be available. 16 Depends on the State Legislature and everybody else. 17 MR. McKENZIE: That's right. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And federal funds coming down. 19 So, you know, don't bet on the come, just like three years 20 ago. 21 MR. LIVERMORE: But the 150 that we now have in 22 there, how long does it take us to get to spend that money? 23 MR. McKENZIE: Three years. 24 MAYOR PRATT: Ed, you got three years left. You 25 have -- you're in -- 109 1 MR. LIVERMORE: So, I mean, they're saying you have 2 the money in the bank. 3 MR. McKENZIE: We've banked it. 4 MR. WOOD: We can have the 150 tomorrow. 5 MR. McKENZIE: Wait a minute, Tom. We don't have 6 to wait three years to get the 150. 7 MR. LIVERMORE: That's what I'm asking. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You got the 150 right now. 9 MR. KING: But you can't spend it. 10 MR. GRIFFIN: It takes three years to get -- 11 MR. McKENZIE: 90/10. 12 MR. KING: 90/10. 13 MR. McKENZIE: That's my understanding, yes, sir. 14 MR. LIVERMORE: What do we -- what do we -- so if 15 we had -- 16 MR. GRIFFIN: If we had a project that costs 17 $150,000, we could go spend that money today. We'd spend 18 that money. If we -- if we have a project and we want TexDOT 19 to help us out, and the project totaled -- and we wanted to 20 get the 90/10, and we have the 10 percent, when that amount 21 gets up to the 90 percent, they'll just transfer it over. 22 It's already our money. 23 MAYOR PRATT: Let me just -- 24 MR. GRIFFIN: They're just banking it for you. 25 MR. LIVERMORE: Let me ask the question this way. 110 1 What if we -- Mr. Rizo, you're getting a lot of use here 2 today, sorry. 3 MR. RIZO: That's fine. 4 MR. LIVERMORE: But what if we were going to build 5 a half a million -- I'm just making numbers up -- half a 6 million dollar building for Mr. Rizo or his twin brother. 7 Can we put 150 -- this 150 against that and pay the 350 out 8 of our pocket, and do it forthwith? 9 MR. GRIFFIN: We could. 10 MR. McKENZIE: That's my understanding, we can. 11 And I will verify that with our airport planner. 12 MAYOR PRATT: And if you look at it, the project, 13 if you had a project of -- I'm just going to throw out a 14 number -- $165,000. You got 150 of it. The City and County 15 would have to come up with the other 15,000. 16 MR. LIVERMORE: Okay. 17 MAYOR PRATT: Okay? That's the bottom line. 18 MR. LIVERMORE: Basically, yeah. 19 MR. KING: Do you think that's how that works? 20 MR. McKENZIE: I think that's how it works, but 21 I'll verify it with -- 22 MR. KING: Verify that. 23 MR. McKENZIE: I will. 24 MR. KING: What's the three years? I don't 25 understand that. 111 1 MR. McKENZIE: If we want the 90/10 funding, we 2 have to wait. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 4 MR. McKENZIE: There's other people in the line -- 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's another funding source. 6 MR. McKENZIE: -- ahead of us. There's people that 7 have asked for -- 8 MR. KING: They're going to take your 150 anyway 9 and use it for 90/10. 10 MR. McKENZIE: I know, Steve. That's just the way 11 they do it. 12 MR. LIVERMORE: That's why I couldn't figure this 13 out. 14 MAYOR PRATT: Making logic out of the government, 15 it doesn't work. 16 MR. McKENZIE: It's the way it works in Austin. 17 MR. LIVERMORE: But we can spend -- if we're going 18 to spend -- if we're going -- if we want to spend the 150 and 19 make up whatever difference, we can get it, big boy. That's 20 what you're saying. 21 MR. KING: Why don't you call our planner and tell 22 them -- 23 MR. LIVERMORE: I think -- 24 MR. KING: -- tell them what our needs are -- what 25 our needs are, and that we have a project that's in the queue 112 1 that we would like to see about funding. We want to fund a 2 $300,000 project. Is any of that money available for funding 3 a $300,000 project? 4 MR. McKENZIE: I will. 5 MR. LIVERMORE: Quickly. Quickly. 6 MR. KING: And quickly. How soon will that -- 7 MR. McKENZIE: The timeline. 8 MR. KING: Give them a specific -- a specific 9 thing, and let them go from there. 10 MR. McKENZIE: Sure. 11 MR. KING: Okay. And then also put us on the list 12 for this 90/10 deal for both projects. 13 MR. McKENZIE: Okay. 14 MR. KING: But tell them that's what the reason is. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably ought to have a 16 motion. 17 MR. WALTERS: I make a motion that we allow our 18 Airport Manager to list two projects with TexDOT, the 10,000 19 square foot building hangar project, and the T-hangar 20 project. 21 MR. LIVERMORE: I second that. 22 MR. KING: Discussion? None being heard, all in 23 favor? 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 5-0.) 25 MR. KING: Thank you. 5-0, okay. That'll be good. 113 1 Item 4G, cost of upgrading the paint hangar. 2 MR. McKENZIE: Might need to let this thing warm up 3 just a second. 4 MR. KING: For those -- 5 MR. LIVERMORE: It's going to be on Steve's head 6 again -- forehead. A little tight there. 7 MAYOR PRATT: While you're waiting for that to warm 8 up, Manuel, did you say 10,000, or was it 10,000 to 12,000? 9 MR. RIZO: 10 to 12. 10 MAYOR PRATT: So you might want to amend your 11 motion to go to 12,000. 12 MR. WALTERS: Okay. I amend the motion that we ask 13 Bruce McKenzie, our Airport Manager, to list two project, a 14 10,000 to 12,000 square foot hangar, and the T-hangar 15 project. 16 MR. KING: Okay. 17 MR. LIVERMORE: Under the rules, you have to ask 18 your second. Your second agrees. 19 MR. KING: Any discussion? None being heard, all 20 in favor? 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 5-0.) 22 MR. KING: 5-0 on the amended proposal. Okay. 23 MR. McKENZIE: Okay. At the last board meeting -- 24 this is a discussion about the paint hangar -- the Mooney 25 paint hangar. At the last board meeting, I was asked to do 114 1 some research and discover what it would take to make that 2 hangar accessible, both vehicularly and with an aircraft, as 3 well as what it would cost to bring the paint hangar up to 4 code electrically. That's -- that's the numbers that I 5 worked up. 6 MR. KING: That's -- that's a 10,000-foot -- 7 MR. McKENZIE: That's a 100-by-100 foot building. 8 MR. KING: Okay. 9 MR. McKENZIE: This asphalt and this taxiway needs 10 to be taken out, and there has to be hot mix and laid again. 11 The base material is probably okay. This part of that 12 taxiway is -- will be fine with a little T.L.C. All of the 13 asphalt around this building needs to be taken out. It's -- 14 it's beyond repair. That needs to be hot mixed again, taken 15 out and hot mixed again. 16 MR. LIVERMORE: Base, you think, might be okay? 17 MR. McKENZIE: For not any heavier than these 18 aircraft are, it probably is, Ed. Now, I didn't know the 19 geo-tech on this at all. This is just working the numbers. 20 Doing that, and then building a road from this point to this 21 gate that is on our property as well off of Peterson Farm 22 Road, and there's -- there's Al Mooney Road right there. 23 Building this road, that does not have to be hot mix. That 24 can be a two-course surface treatment, which is much more 25 economical. But it has to be a paved road, because we're in 115 1 the city limits, A, and B, the fire trucks will not go on a 2 road unless it's paved. That's what they told me. 3 MAYOR PRATT: That's right. 4 MR. McKENZIE: That's -- that's a city street; they 5 won't go off the pavement. That will give us access from the 6 road to the hangar. The hangar itself, the only thing I 7 did -- and I sent Bill a copy of this because he wanted to 8 see it. The electrical contractor that we use at the 9 airport, we spent about two and a half hours out there at 10 that building, and he told me -- and I said this in the last 11 meeting. It would take -- he said, I'm just -- after two and 12 a half hours of looking at that, he said, "You're looking at 13 about $28,000 to $30,000 just to bring this building up to 14 code electrically." So, factoring all those in, building a 15 road, this is a two-course surface treatment, re-hot mixing 16 this and re-hot mixing this, you're looking at around $94,000 17 just for materials alone. That's assuming that our owners 18 will do the paving for us. 19 MR. KING: Does 94,000 include the electrical? 20 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, that includes the 21 electrical. 22 MR. LIVERMORE: What about the roof structure? 23 MR. McKENZIE: The roof doesn't leak. It hasn't -- 24 that I've seen, it hasn't leaked. 25 MR. KING: How much was the electrical? 116 1 MR. McKENZIE: He told me between 28,000 and 2 30,000. 3 MAYOR PRATT: Are you talking about the paint 4 hangar? 5 MR. McKENZIE: That's the paint hangar. 6 MAYOR PRATT: I was under the impression that it 7 did leak. 8 MR. McKENZIE: Well, it may have some leaks in it, 9 but it's not like -- it's not like these here. 10 MAYOR PRATT: Well, no. But, I mean, a leak's a 11 leak. Still have to -- 12 MR. McKENZIE: I've been over there when it rained, 13 and it didn't. 14 MAYOR PRATT: Okay. 15 MR. McKENZIE: I haven't seen anything significant, 16 but that's not to say that it doesn't. Steve, that's to 17 repave this taxiway, everything around that hangar, bring 18 this up to code, and repave and put a gate right here. 19 MR. KING: Mm-hmm. 20 THE REPORTER: Excuse me. I'm sorry to -- I'm 21 having a battery problem. Could you give me just a minute? 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 - - - - - - - - - - 24 MR. McKENZIE: All right. Can I go ahead, Steve? 25 MR. KING: Is it on? Okay. It's the 117 1 Kerrville-Kerr County Joint Airport Board, and we're taking 2 the minutes by recorder also, to supplement Kathy's. Okay, 3 go ahead. 4 MR. McKENZIE: This is just a different angle of 5 this that I took. This is before we built our T-hangars, but 6 this is the area that we've got to prepare. That's what I 7 was asked to do. I got -- that would get us to the building, 8 both with aircraft and with the vehicular traffic, and get 9 the electric up to code to occupy the building. Now, beyond 10 that, I don't know what anyone would want to do with the 11 building. I mean, I'd be -- 12 MR. LIVERMORE: It's going to be $100,000 13 minimally? 14 MR. McKENZIE: Yeah, minimally. Minimally. 15 MR. GRIFFIN: For us to start using it. That's not 16 a problem. 17 MR. McKENZIE: That's what it's going to cost. 18 MR. LIVERMORE: What is our revenue stream? 19 MR. KING: It's about -- well, I mean, it's based 20 on that -- based on the -- on the 3.18. It's $2,650 a month, 21 which is less than a three-year pay-out on $100,000. 22 MR. LIVERMORE: But it's not three -- it would be 23 3.18, wouldn't it? 24 MR. KING: So it would be less than three years. 25 It's 3.95 -- three-year pay-out. Excuse me, did I do that 118 1 wrong? 2 MR. LIVERMORE: But that presumes receiving full 3 revenue from the start. 4 MR. KING: Right. 5 MR. LIVERMORE: Not what he proposed. 6 MR. KING: The 36-month payout, 35.84. So, I don't 7 know what the condition of the hangar inside is as far as 8 occupying it, Bruce. Does it have -- is there a compressor 9 in there? 10 MR. McKENZIE: Not any more. 11 MR. KING: Took the compressor out? 12 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 13 MR. KING: Is there airplanes and stuff -- 14 MR. McKENZIE: The airplanes are there, but the 15 compressor's gone. 16 MR. KING: Yeah. 17 MR. WOOD: What were we going to use the building 18 for? Just aircraft storage, or just repair? 19 MR. WALTERS: Repair. 20 MR. LIVERMORE: Repair? 21 MR. KING: We could use it for repairs. I mean, I 22 think we have to look at that. It might cost you 300 or 400 23 -- 300-something thousand to build that hangar. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How many square feet? 25 MR. KING: 10,000. 119 1 MR. McKENZIE: 10,000. Would that work for Manuel? 2 MR. RIZO: The door won't open wide enough. Not 3 tall enough. 4 MR. KING: Yeah. What is the width of those doors, 5 Bruce? Do we know? 6 MR. McKENZIE: 80 feet. The problem is the depth 7 behind the 80 feet is only 15 feet. 8 MR. GRIFFIN: Because it's a triangle on the 9 inside. You don't have -- it's -- it's probably an 80-foot 10 door, but you've only got 10 feet away from the door that you 11 could put something in. 12 MR. KING: Did we determine that you could knock 13 all that down inside? It's not weight -- 14 MR. GRIFFIN: I think you could. 15 MR. KING: I don't think it even goes to the 16 ceiling. 17 MR. WOOD: If it could be used for aircraft 18 storage, -- 19 MR. GRIFFIN: Yeah. 20 MR. WOOD: -- that would be an advantage. Then 21 that would free up some other space. 22 MR. GRIFFIN: Right. 23 MR. KING: Okay. Well, you gave us the numbers on 24 the -- on the rebuild of it, I mean, to get it -- till you 25 get access to it. Let us -- let's look at the inside of it 120 1 now and see what the structural part of it -- see if we could 2 knock it down, make it into one 10,000 square foot hangar. I 3 think it's just -- cinder block walls don't go up to the top. 4 MR. GRIFFIN: They go up to the top, because when 5 they paint, they don't want to over-spray. I think it could 6 come down in the inside. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think it could too. I think 8 it's just partitions. 9 MR. KING: Is the floor flat, or does it have 10 drains? 11 MR. McKENZIE: It has a drain around the edge of 12 it, Steve. It has a grate around the outer edge right behind 13 the doors, all the way around it. 14 MR. KING: Okay. 15 MR. McKENZIE: Then it has those hydraulic lifts in 16 every one of the bays. 17 MR. KING: Right. 18 MR. GRIFFIN: And the only -- yeah, the only thing 19 there is that our friends across the way have asked us that 20 if -- if we do something with it, not to eliminate the chance 21 of using those hydraulic lifts again. They may be interested 22 in the building. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Not to eliminate the use of it 24 as a paint hangar sometime in the future. 25 MR. GRIFFIN: Right. 121 1 MR. KING: Okay. Well, we'll take that under 2 consideration. 3 MR. GRIFFIN: Right. I just -- 4 MR. KING: Okay. So I think we can proceed from 5 there. Let's look at the inside of the building now, Bruce, 6 and see what can we do -- what the outside of the building is 7 worth. Let's see what the inside of the building is, okay? 8 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 9 MR. KING: Anybody else have any questions on that? 10 Thank you, Bruce. 11 MR. McKENZIE: That's -- 12 MR. KING: That's good. And that's with someone 13 else laying that. That's with help from the owners to lay 14 it. 15 MR. GRIFFIN: Yes. 16 MR. KING: Correct? 17 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, that's just for materials 18 only. 19 MR. KING: Materials only, okay. All right. Item 20 4-H, the interlocal agreement. I put this on the agenda 21 because I was told by somebody that that comes up next year. 22 Is that correct? 23 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, it expires in September of 24 '16. 25 MR. KING: '16. And at some point, we're going to 122 1 have to put a committee together. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think the County's going to 3 look at that in March. 4 MR. KING: We should probably hold off. I want to 5 get at least a two-person committee together for the airport 6 to sit in on that and talk to whoever wants to talk about 7 that interlocal agreement. 8 MR. WOOD: The interlocal agreement is with -- is 9 between the City and the County? 10 MR. KING: It's between the City and the County, 11 right. Okay. 12 MR. LIVERMORE: Are we a party to it, or is it 13 just -- 14 MR. KING: They want us to be. One party, I know, 15 at least wants us to be a party to it. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sure, yeah. 17 MR. KING: Because if there's any changes to be 18 made to it, they want our input. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. I think you guys ought 20 to take a look at it first, okay, and then -- 21 MR. KING: I think we'd have to find out -- I think 22 we'd have to find out -- I'm assuming that this wouldn't even 23 be a fact -- an issue if there wasn't one party that wanted 24 to make some changes to it, and that's what I understand. 25 So, if the -- if there is any changes to be made to it, and 123 1 there is any discussion made to it, I think the Airport Board 2 would like to have at least two representatives there to 3 discuss these -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 5 MR. KING: -- changes, and how they would impact 6 the airport. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I can't see any problem. 8 MR. KING: Okay. 9 MR. WOOD: Would -- are you still going to be a 10 commissioner? 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Hmm? 12 MR. WOOD: Are you still going to be in office 13 9/16? 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 15 MR. WOOD: And the mayor too? I don't know when 16 the elections are. 17 MR. LIVERMORE: Mayor comes up -- 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Regardless of who it is, there 19 will be somebody from the City and somebody from the County. 20 MR. KING: Let's just look at it after the first of 21 the year, but we are going to appoint a committee for that. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, good. 23 MR. KING: I didn't know when it came up. That's 24 why -- I was just approached by somebody to talk about this. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 124 1 MR. KING: Okay. All right. General update? 2 MR. McKENZIE: We've completed our fifth mowing 3 cycle. We said that at the top of the meeting. There is a 4 pending sale of Dugosh Aircraft Maintenance. James Gandy 5 says he's going to sell out. And -- 6 MR. KING: Does he know to who? 7 MR. McKENZIE: He's talking to one of the gentlemen 8 that works over there now. And I've talked to both of them, 9 and they say -- 10 MR. KING: Is it a pending sale or a proposed sale? 11 MR. McKENZIE: Proposed sale. 12 MR. KING: Not a proposed -- a possible sale. 13 MR. McKENZIE: Well, if you talk to two of them, 14 you get two different stories, but they're negotiating. 15 That's the last word I got Thursday. 16 MR. WOOD: Bottom line is, James Gandy doesn't want 17 to be the owner of Dugosh any more. 18 MR. McKENZIE: That's my understanding, 19 Commissioner. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Bye. 21 MR. McKENZIE: That's my understanding. 22 MR. KING: Okay. And all parties are aware -- 23 MR. McKENZIE: Just so -- 24 MR. KING: -- of the agreement that we have with 25 Mr. Kennedy that requires a maintenance facility to be part 125 1 of his lease? 2 MR. McKENZIE: And that was brought up, as well as 3 the situation with Mr. Rizo. If that happens -- I mean, 4 they're negotiating on it now, and I'm not going -- won't get 5 into that. But -- 6 MR. WOOD: Would that space over there be adequate? 7 MR. McKENZIE: He could start over there. 8 MR. RIZO: Yes. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Mr. Kennedy could move his part of 10 Hangar 4, move that down, use part of Hangar 4. I mean, 11 they're working all -- they're running the traps on 12 everything. 13 MR. KING: Who is? 14 MR. McKENZIE: Joey and Mr. Rizo. 15 MR. KING: You've talked to Mr. Kennedy about this? 16 MR. RIZO: Yes, I have, once. 17 MR. McKENZIE: So -- 18 MR. KING: And Mr. Kennedy's talking to a third 19 party also. 20 MR. McKENZIE: I don't know that. I just know that 21 he's talking to them. 22 MR. RIZO: But it's preliminary, you know. I told 23 him that, and we agreed that he and his tenant need to iron 24 out the details before I get involved and try to, -- 25 MR. KING: Okay. 126 1 MR. RIZO: -- you know, actually -- 2 MR. LIVERMORE: James is a sub-tenant? 3 MR. KING: Right, of Kennedy. And all parties 4 understand that any sub-lease has to be approved by the 5 Airport Board? 6 MR. McKENZIE: I've told everybody. 7 MR. KING: You told them that, okay. Has to be 8 approved by the Airport Board prior to anyone going into 9 business. 10 MR. McKENZIE: I told all the parties that. 11 MR. KING: Okay, that's all we need. 12 MR. McKENZIE: I just wanted you to be aware that 13 that's -- 14 MR. KING: Yeah, that we're potentially -- we're 15 potentially losing our maintenance facility. 16 MR. WOOD: For pistons. 17 MR. KING: For pistons. And that something will be 18 there -- hopefully be there to replace it. Mr. Kennedy will 19 replace it. 20 MR. McKENZIE: Mr. Kennedy knows that he's got to 21 have a maintenance facility on this field. 22 MR. KING: Where's Joey? He left. 23 MR. McKENZIE: But he knows. 24 MR. KING: Okay. Okay. Mr. Gandy will keep it in 25 place until he sells it? 127 1 MR. McKENZIE: That's my understanding. 2 MR. KING: Okay. There's Mr. Kennedy right there. 3 MR. McKENZIE: Do you want to talk to him? 4 MR. KING: Yeah, why don't we get him in here and 5 discuss this a little further? It's not on the agenda. 6 (Mr. Kennedy joined the meeting.) 7 MR. WOOD: We're in the general update session, and 8 we were talking about the maintenance facility, James Gandy's 9 situation and all that. 10 MR. KING: Do you have a general update for us, 11 Joey? 12 MR. KENNEDY: Basically, he's selling it to David. 13 MR. KING: Okay. Do you think that is a proposed 14 sale, or -- 15 MR. HOLLENBEAK: David Baron? 16 MR. McKENZIE: I think that's probably the best 17 course of action for those guys in the shop. I mean the way 18 James was -- was operating it, the overhead, there's -- I 19 mean, I've seen the numbers. I've done it, been there. 20 There's no way they could make that work with just those guys 21 doing it. And it sounds like it's going to happen. 22 MR. KING: Proceeding. It's proceeding. 23 MR. McKENZIE: Yeah. 24 MR. WOOD: It's a buyable option for David, do you 25 think? 128 1 MR. KENNEDY: Yes. 2 MR. KING: Okay. So, that's -- 3 MR. McKENZIE: Tell him what you told me about 4 everybody needs to know -- 5 MR. KING: As long as David knows that whenever he 6 gets a deal put together and everything with James, he'll 7 just bring it back to the board, and we'll stamp it and say 8 fine, just like we did for James. 9 MR. KENNEDY: They've been kind of going back and 10 forth. 11 MR. KING: I've already told David that. I talked 12 to David personally, told him, yeah. So he knows. Okay. 13 Thanks for the update. Good. Good. All right. Anybody 14 else have an update? No? None being heard, -- 15 MR. LIVERMORE: So moved. 16 MR. KING: -- motion to adjourn? 17 MR. WALTERS: Second. 18 MR. KING: Seconded by Mr. Walters. All in favor? 19 Aye. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 5-0.) 21 MR. KING: Thank you, guys. 22 MR. McKENZIE: Thank y'all. 23 (Airport Board meeting adjourned at 11:04 a.m.) 24 - - - - - - - - - - 25 129 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 I, Kathy Banik, official reporter for Kerr County, 4 Texas, do hereby certify that the above and foregoing is a 5 true and complete transcription of my stenotype notes taken 6 at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 25th day of September, 8 2015. 9 _______________________________ Kathy Banik, Texas CSR # 6483 10 Expiration Date: 12/31/16 Official Court Reporter 11 Kerr County, Texas 700 Main Street 12 Kerrville, Texas 78028 Phone: 830-792-2295 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25